new patch

[smoakingun]

I am designing a new patch for summer here in fl. We have all suffered through events with temps over 100 and humidity over 80%. I was going to call it a hellseed patch, but some folks think that might be a bit......agresive? So I need name ideas. Saunaseed? Sweatseed? Swampseed? Somethingseed? Let's have your ideas.

[2 clicks low]

I would check with Fred before you put too much effort into it.
There was an idea for a desert patch for 110+.... didn't go far.
"I think" the idea is to not have too many, don't want to get into the collect all 12 mindset. It's about saving the country , not collecting ribbons. Once you make rifleman, better to collect hats than patches.

2 clicks low

[TomM1Thumb]

I think a Hellseed Patch would go over well in Most of the South Eastern States, From Florida to South Carolina, West to Texas. Remember short sleeves, and Hot Brass don't mix well.

Learning, Instructing, and requalifying in a Different State Should be Recommended, as it helps to strengthenen the bonds of leadership and learning, for all Appleseeder's involved.

[DeadEyeRed]

I agree that it has to be passed by Fred, but i think the idea is AWESOME. If we can have a WINTER seed patch...we should be able to have a saunaseed or hell seed. Appleseed is a great program, but until you have laid in the sweat of 5 of your closest new friends and shared hot brass ...you truely do not know hell. As far as the name...alternatives maybe summerseed,steamseed, wrinkled appleseed (what does a hot apple do?). good luck Smoakin Gun.Anything we can do to help this happen, do NOT hesitate to call.  teresa

[oladcock]

Might be appropriate as we battle the demonseed!   ...O.L.

[ATM]

InfernoSeed

 

[douglas34474]

BAKEDAPPLESEED

[2 clicks low]

BAKEDAPPLESEED

I withdraw my prior post.

I WANT ONE OF THESE!

2cl

[smoakingun]

I hadn't thought about it, but the patch is not about patch collecting, but I watched, at no less than 10 events last year, folks on the line lying in pools of their own sweat, one girl went home with heat exhaustion on Saturday come back and suffer more on Sunday then shoot score. Lines with no or limited shade. Moms, dads, and kids showing real grit and determination to come out in the heat, sometimes 2 and 3 times in the same summer. The patch is intended as just a little extra for those who persevere, and to save the other patches for those who wait for nicer weather.

[brianheeter]

How 'bout "Swelterseed?"  Temps over 90* F and relative humidity over 90%?  I like the idea.  We have a Winterseed patch that honors those that persevered in the cold, why not have one that honors those that endure the heat?

brian

[Tornado]

  Finally! 
I shot my Riflemen score in record heat and nearly melted away.  Thankfully I shot 210 and got baptized.   Please, please, pleasecan we have a Heat stroke patch.   When the gun is so hot that it burns you when you pick it up and you've sweat through you appleseed t-shirt and look like you've showered in it.  You really have earned a patch.

The lettering should look melted and flames should be shooting out of it.

  Bring out a summer seed patch!  Please 

[PaxxAZ]

Being from AZ, one of our shoot bosses thought of "Suns of Liberty" patch. We where at 106 for our April 20th shoot. For those who mention the "dry heat" aspect. At 110 rolling down your window on the freeway is like having a giant blow dryer blowing on you. And at 114+ pavement gets to about 185 reflecting heat back at you. Lows at night of 98 because the pavement keeps the heat.

I have been in both. At 105 I'll take the dry.  110 + things start to change. 115 never been in a humid place at that temp, but deep breaths burn in dry places.

I would propose the badge be for 110+ as it presents major discomfort and keeping hydrated can be dangerous if you only drink water. But that is just me.

[Two Wolves]

What's next? The sunshine patch  , rain patch  , wind and dust patch ? It troubles me to see seasoned riflemen complain and then lobby for these type of rewards  . Why? Because there is no end to this type of dialogue  . You are all slipping into that entitlement mentality where you deserve something special  .
Being an Appleseed volunteer is what makes you special.   
I would hope that, being riflemen, you would have a moment of clarity.

Different types of rifleman's patches  only leads to class warfare amongst us.

My America,my Appleseed, my mission~Two Wolves

[douglas34474]

Then why is there a "WINTERSEED" patch?

[9mm4545]

Then why is there a "WINTERSEED" patch?

Very good question, IMHO.

[Pitmaster]

Then why is there a "WINTERSEED" patch?

I suspect because the Northern side of the War Between the States lobbied for it.

[dragonfly]

Then why is there a "WINTERSEED" patch?

To help encourage those that may have had doubts in the fact that Appleseeds could be held 52 weeks out of the year no matter the weather, rain, snow, or shine.  http://appleseedinfo.org/smf/index.php?topic=11213.msg92220#msg92220  It has helped fill the lines in some area's of the country  .

D-fly     Keeping the Faith

[oladcock]

I agree Paxx, anything over about 105, it doesn't matter if it's dry or not! One we last year was 106 on Sat and 107 on Sun. No line shade. We're at just shy of 4000ft so the intensity of the sun is much greater than having a mile more of filter! Ready to do it again!

If there is some kind of "bait" we can use to get em on the line, I'm for it. But I have mixed emotions over being allowed to pick and choose to collect different patches. Once that goal is met, different conditions should have no bearing on a "Rifleman"....O.L.

[Two Wolves]

Then why is there a "WINTERSEED" patch?

Most likely because someone thought they suffered  more than another and therefore they lobbied for it. After others who then decided they were entitled to be rewarded for their suffering chimed in  , it became a reality . Now we get the snowball effect.  (pun intended) My suffering is greater than yours.

You could have just as well had an EXTREMESEED. To me that's a riflemans patch.

Do you think an Eskimo that shoots a riflemans score in his element is somehow different than a desert Indian who shoots a rifleman score in his element?

Look, I'm all for personal achievement and recognition. Go get your patch that says 40 BELOW or I'm tougher than dirt and put it on your jacket. Then you can tell others how you persevered.

Just don't diminish what we've all struggled to achieve. I love you all but I think you need a splash of COLD water.

P.S. Now , if I could just get those pesky Applecore rockers made. 

Regards, Two Wolves

[SSG Platz]

What's next? The sunshine patch  , rain patch  , wind and dust patch ? It troubles me to see seasoned riflemen complain and then lobby for these type of rewards  . Why? Because there is no end to this type of dialogue  . You are all slipping into that entitlement mentality where you deserve something special  .
Being an Appleseed volunteer is what makes you special.   
I would hope that, being riflemen, you would have a moment of clarity.

Different types of rifleman's patches  only leads to class warfare amongst us.

My America,my Appleseed, my mission~Two Wolves

Your just use to the marine corp, they are too poor for ribbons and patches.

[smoakingun]

As far as I know, a shooter is issued a patch once for shooting score, they don't get to come back and collect patches. This patch is not intended for instructors to collect. The patch is intended for students, first timers who fill the lines while a lot of others are waiting on cooler weather.

[Two Wolves]

It don't matter.

What divides us, conquers us.

United we stand, divided we fall.

SSG Platz--- You are absolutely correct, my patch says Marines, why would I neeeeeed anything else?

Love ya man---now lets do some shoot'n and recruit'n.  ~Two Wolves

[6MMBOB]

Go read To Hell and Back by Audie Murphy.
If you still think you need a special patch,Thenby all means run it by Fred.

[SSG Platz]

Go read To Hell and Back by Audie Murphy.
If you still think you need a special patch,Thenby all means run it by Fred.

Trust me I know all about Audie Murphy, spent quite some time and a all expenses paied vacation to Iraq in 2003 with 3rd ID.

Two wolves, glad you didn't get upset by a little friendly ribbing, good to see there are a few people with a sense of humor.

~PlatzOut~

~

[mattra]

Why is patch collecting bad? Seriously, if you want people to come out more than once, then multiple patches aren't a bad idea. Most adults probably aren't going to care that much about collecting patches, but I could see kids really getting into it. Anything that gets kids interested is fine by me. They are going to get really good marksmanship instruction and get valuable history lessons about how our country was started. At first the motivation might be an extra patch, but I can see how the core values could start to set in and really make a difference. After all, these kids will one day grow up and vote, so anything that can be done to entice them to really learn the core principals our country was founded on shouldn't be viewed so negatively.

[PaxxAZ]

Hmmmm...This is turning more into more patches or less patches thing.
I would have gone for the 210 patch or no patch. My greatest Appleseed achievement so far has been 3 shots in the V at stage 4.
Let's see, the arguments against patches are:
1.   They are frivolous.
2.   They divide us.
3.   They are not needed.
4.   I don't need no stinking Patches

Point 1:
They are Frivolous. Yes they are, for some.

Point 2:
I am not getting anything on how they divide us, other than that we have different feelings about them. Obvious from this posting.

Point 3.
Nothing is needed, one can argue if Appleseed is needed. On this it is felt by most here that it (Appleseed)is. Is the Rifleman Patch needed? No. Why? It serves as nothing other than a symbol of going to an Appleseed, reaching a certain score and that score being witnessed. You still made the score.
So on point 1 and 3 I agree, no patches are needed, nor are Hats, nor rockers, nor shooting jackets, nor pins, nor tee shirts....
Point 4, personal choice, one of the reasons I am in Appleseed, leave others to their wants, wishes and accomplishments. Did you take a Rifleman patch when it was offered? That was a choice. Some people want more choices.

Quoting Two Wolves;
"SSG Platz--- You are absolutely correct, my patch says Marines, why would I neeeeeed anything else?"
Are you less of a Marine if you don't have that patch? How is it needed?

My personal opinion:
Patches are fun, something we probably should try to interject more of in Appleseed. We have a hard road in front of us, we may fail, we may succeed. Patches are not something I will quit over one way or another, I don't care strongly enough.
I belong to another organization, very different from this one, and they often have Patches for singular events, for example there would be a  "Douglas, WY 2012 RBC", patch would be gotten just for attending. I think attending and getting 210, is a bit better. The organization I belong to even has ribbons / streamers for number of weekly events you have been to in one location 10 = one Yellow streamers, 100 (minimum 2 years in) is marked by a larger off color streamer. Some groups only give Patches if you pass their initiation... in our case 210, but it identifies that particular sub-group, and you as a member.
I have 5 or six patches in different a storage bins, my girlfriend has hundreds some on her jacket, most in drawers and such.  The only ones she keeps on display on her event coat are memorable or important to her.
What do the different patches and streamers and such do, it tells people at a glance where you have been, how long you have been at it. It also makes for an easy conversation starter.

I also know this organization has more current and former military members then Appleseed. I have yet to hear a single remark there against Patches other then "oh, another patch".
In the military your "Ribbons and Medals" do the same. Navy Arctic and Antarctic service ribbon???


My Point:
So while I agree they are not needed and mostly frivolous, I argue that they are fun. For some people they are incentive to get off the couch and get to another Appleseed. Usually they will bring others with them, even if they do not volunteer to be an instructor.
We need to remember we are not the military and we can have some fun.
We have a long tough mission ahead of us, we must always be looking at the prize. But not be blind to the potential community building we can do as well. I hope for the Day when we can have a RWVA convention on a yearly basis and have a few thousand people show up.
We will not get there if we are just "You shot rifleman, take a hat or leave. If you are not for the mission, you are taking up line space and instructor time".
We have people sacrificing weekends with Loved ones for Appleseed.
If I can get a loved one on the line again, simply because she really wants a particular patch, I go from somewhat indifferent to "Hell Ya!!! We need more Patches". I still do not see the harm, if you don't like them, don't take them or wear them.


What I can imagine in the future:
Rule, Odd Patches only on requalification. State Patches (I love that idea), Lady Seed Patches, LBGT Seed Patches (we all know what that will look like). State environmental patches (habbobs, heat, cold, rain, drizzle, fog, nice pleasant day, wind....).
This way, Florida can have their Swamp patch at 100 degrees+ 80%+ humidity; AZ can have their Desert Rat Patch 110 degrees+... And we can have the Habanero Pepper Challenge, where you shoot a quick AQT (4 min) after eating a diced Habanero and before drinking any liquids and score a 210+. I would travel for that, and if there was a Patch for it, I would probably wear it places other than Appleseed.
If those wishes are confused with entitlement, so be it.

[Two Wolves]

PaxxAZ---don't get the wrong idea about me and patches.  I've got a whole motorcycle jacket covered in them.(from daze gone bye).

I am constantly searching my mind (when I'm not searching for my mind) for ideas on how to bring new people to the line and how to get a message to those people that they will hear. I like the idea of supplementary patches but we take the risk of becoming----cheezie.

All in all, this has been a fun discusion for me however it turns out. I'm still after those Applecore rockers---(Patriot Gal--are you listening?)

Regards~Two Wolves

[2 clicks low]

And we can have the Habanero Pepper Challenge, where you shoot a quick AQT (4 min) after eating a diced Habanero and before drinking any liquids and score a 210+. I would travel for that, and if there was a Patch for it, I would probably wear it places other than Appleseed.

You are a genius. Design the patch and I will chop peppers. 

[Superheat]

BAKEDAPPLESEED

Baked AS must be shot on 4/20 at 4:20.  Stoners will get it.  LOL.

Let me explain.  "Baked" is slang for being under the influence of marijuana.  I would not use the term "baked"seed. 

[dragonfly]

I really like the Applecore rocker     .

D

PaxxAZ---don't get the wrong idea about me and patches.  I've got a whole motorcycle jacket covered in them.(from daze gone bye).

I am constantly searching my mind (when I'm not searching for my mind) for ideas on how to bring new people to the line and how to get a message to those people that they will hear. I like the idea of supplementary patches but we take the risk of becoming----cheezie.

All in all, this has been a fun discusion for me however it turns out. I'm still after those Applecore rockers---(Patriot Gal--are you listening?)

Regards~Two Wolves