Thoughts for my left-eye-dominant youth shooter?

[AF5US]

Okay team, help me check my math.  Tell me if my plan falls apart somewhere, or if you have a better suggestion:

I work shoots roughly once or twice a month; sometimes my girls go with to help.  My 8 year old daughter is interested in trigger time.  I'm all for that (obviously), but there are a few significant considerations:
1. My children are all petite.  That's just the way they are.  A standard length of pull is a challenge, and may continue to be for some time to come.
2. After some initial "let's try this," she is showing a very strong left eye dominance.  Yes, she could learn to shoot with her right eye - but she is still young and I want this to be fun for her, not a source of frustration.
3. I'm willing to invest in my children, but I don't want to invest too much in equipment, until I know that this is something she will continue to be interested in.

After some research, here's what I'm thinking:
Savage 50702 MKIIGLY .22 LR Youth - Left Hand

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/24841/Savage+50702+MKIIGLY+22LR+AT+YOUTH+LH+WD

Runs in the $200 range, which is reasonable.  Left-handed.  Bolt-action but magazine fed, which means that starting out she won't go crazy pulling the trigger, but could still use it at an Appleseed shoot.  Wood stock makes it a little heavier, but 5 lbs isn't bad.  Extra magazines run around $15, and it seems like the $75 tech sights designed for the adult Savage will probably fit
https://www.tech-sights.com/product/savage-mark-ii-rifle-adjustable-aperture-sights/

Given some of the requirements, what do we think? Am I missing something where this plan falls apart? Is there a better option?

Thanks in advance!

[Mike AKA Bandaid]

That looks like an excellent choice. And I can tell you from experience, the Savage AccuTrigger is fantastic. It's easy to adjust, and is nice and crisp. They include a small tool to adjust the trigger weight. Id say, "buy it" and get 4-5 extra magazines at the same time.

That rifle will get passed down to the next generation as a treasured "first rifle".

[Dodgepower74]

Those Savage Mark 2's is what the Boy Scouts use on their Rifle ranges at  summer camp.  They take a huge beating and keep running.  I've seen them run some of the dirtiest cheap ammo through them and only clean them once a week.  I wouldn't hesitate to buy one. 

[Kimber Custom]

Petite makes me think she will have to break position to work the bolt. I built a 10/22 lightweight that comes in about 4lbs. Tacsol barrel, blackhawk adjustable stock. 2moa red dot. Doesn't resolve the left eye dominance issue but might be worth considering.

You might just put her on a bi-pod for a while. She can work on breath and trigger control for a while. Next work on NPOA. When she's shooting out the V's, worry about slings and rifle fit. Just a thought.

[maxwell]

I think you're on the right track by having her shoot lefty. 3/4 of my kids are cross-dominant like me, which makes things interesting; I own no left-handed firearms, although I put a left-handed safety on the AR I use for CMP matches.

Kids grow so fast that I was always hesitant to buy a dedicated youth rifle, so I lean more towards Kimber Custom's suggestion of an adjustable stock 10/22 on a sandbag or bipod for an 8 year-old. The semiauto does allow wasting ammo, but you can control that with structured shooting time. I prefer it over a bolt action as it's fewer things to manipulate, and you can focus on safety and six steps of firing a shot without breaking position or struggling with a bolt. Someone recently posted a left-side 10/22 charging handle, but I've not found any right-handed semiauto to be an impediment.

Good luck and good shooting!

[Nashville Stage]

As to the bolt vs. semi-auto decision, my semi-rabling point that I'll throw in is that while a semi-auto is possible to set-up with ambidextrous controls & can be more flexible, a boltie will really help with concentrating on each individual shot. That's the reason I got a CZ452 before I got a 10/22. Heck, I still enjoy shooting a boltie because it forces my brain to settle down & relax. I guess it depends on where your kids are mentally & skill-wise, too. If they're shooting ok, but the bolt action is hampering them, then a semi-auto would be a benefit.

Having grown up as the smallest kid on the firing range, I can totally relate to the frustration of trying to manhandle a rifle that's too big & too heavy. I recently bought a Savage Rascal in a synthetic stock just to have around for smaller kids who want to use it. Yeah, it's a single-shot, but it's not slow to load, and it's stupidly light & short. It's also fun, in a very different way than a 10/22. Can you shoot Rifleman with it? Maybe not for a younger kid, but a younger kid who's just starting out isn't going to do that anyway. The questions (at least for me) are: will they have fun shooting it, and can they learn some of the fundamentals with it?

[Charles McKinley]

I teach to the dominate eye.

Do you own a band saw?

The youth model Savage will still probably need a few modifications.

A 10/22 is also easily modified for a youth shooter. 

I have been down this road a few times and I have built the rifles it is not difficult.  FullMetalRifleman was 8 when she started and was and much to her chagrin still is petite.  I started with the ATI folding and collapsible 10/22 stock.  The Blackhawk is a much better choice but I didn't know about it.

Savage left handed bolt:
Shorter length of pull
Thin the front of stock and add a piece so the front of the magazine is flush.
Buy the STAINLESS STEEL magazines.  I hear they are a bit stiffer and have fewer problems with the feed lips.  I laughed out loud when a full mag of shells came out at my daughter but she was not amused.

10/22
Find the compact model if you can.  Stock is smaller in all dimensions and a 16" barrel.
To modify a regular stock shorten the length of pull and the front of the stock.  I cut it off where they narrow it for the barrel band.  Narrow the front and take some off the bottom as well.  The pistol grip can be thinned out as well.  You may want to add some material to the front of it the get the hand moved forward to make it easier to reach the trigger.

I will try to attach some pics later but the forum was blocking pics I tried to post.  If I can't get them on here I'll post a YouTube video.

Chuck

[Charles McKinley]

This is the latest build.  It is a cut down factory 10/22 wood stock, Cosmic Purple powder coat, William's rear peep and Ruger 50th Anniversary front sight.

[Leadlined]

Great topic, and one I just worked through.

My 9-year-old daughter also wanted some trigger time, but I happened to have the Marlin 15Y single shot bolt that was my first rifle.  She had lots of trouble operating the bolt, and I ended up having her on a sandbag with my 10/22, because frustration was about all she was learning.

With instruction on proper trigger control and breathing, she was dissecting clays on the berm from 50 yards with low magnification.

I then picked up a compact 10/22 and put a GI sling and Vortex Crossfire 2-7x on it, and it's been a success.  The compact has a shortened stock and a shorter barrel to match, keeping a nice balance.  With the auto bolt release mod, it's kept the lessons fun and interesting.

An additional note: when you head to the range, bring a variety of targets as you can.  The shoot-n-see type of targets are a hit, as are things like clays, tin cans and steel targets.   Variety and reaction helps hold the interest where a plain paper target isn't quite as successful.

Now, she doesn't have the cross-dominant issue, but I do.  I shoot weak-eye'd.  I'm not sure if I'd do the same if I had it to do again.   It's a tough world for a lefty shooter, equipment-wise.  But both eyes open is a huge help in practical shooting.

[AF5US]

I'm grateful for all of the thoughts and tips.  If anyone has any additional ideas, please feel free to keep posting them.

At this point, I think I'm going to continue with the plan for a left-handed rifle.  I understand that on some models, the controls can be switched or made ambidextrous.  Call me an overprotective father - I probably am - but I'm just not a fan of having the extraction port that close to my daughter's face.  If she decides in the future to work on shooting like that, or to shoot weak eye, I'll be all for helping her.  Right now I also need to keep frustration levels down, and fun levels up.  I'm not a rich man, but this first rifle is within my budget.  She has 3 younger siblings; the next in line is right-eye dominant but the other two are a little too young to know yet.  If nothing else, I can be the instructor at the shoots that has a left-eye rifle for the youth shooter 

I understand the arguments for bolt action vs. semi-auto.  I think this is another case where's pros and cons either way.  To my mind, bolt is the way for her to go because:
1. Each shot counts more (she has cousins that are a little too cavalier - "spray & pray")
2. I think it's likely she'll appreciate the convenience of semi-auto that much more in the future - and there will be plenty of time for that

Yes, there's more to manipulate - but I think it's within her capabilities.  She's not going to be rocking a 210+ score anytime soon, but that will be true regardless of the action.  If it gets to the point where that's what's stopping her, I can always get her a new rifle then.

I do like that the Savage has good reviews on durability - both here and online reviews I've read.  At this price point, it should also serve as an inexpensive first rifle to gauge how serious the interest level is.

Several of you mentioned sandbags - I didn't originally mention this, but that's definitely the plan until I have a strong enough confidence level that she can safely handle the rifle & at least hit paper, before we get into any transitions.

Regarding the target ideas - our Appleseed shoots are usually limited to rimfire, but I did get a chance to take her where she could get prone on my AR-15 with a collapsible stock.  That allowed me to work out some of the issues she was having (eye dominance & length of pull), and she got to pop balloons at 50 yards.  A good time was had by all 

If you've got something to add, keep the conversation going - I think this topic is probably useful for us at a higher level, as I'm sure my girl won't be the first - or last - shooter that has both body size & eye dominance considerations.

[Morpheus]

Both of my daughters are strongly left-eye dominant, and are most definitely right handed. For them, teaching to the dominant eye would have caused more frustration than just simply taping over the left lens of their shooting glasses. My now 20 year-old still uses the taped over glasses when she shoots, although I believe that her advanced skill level may not require it anymore. My 9 year-old still has a ways to go and throughly enjoys shooting her Cricket (with her taped over shooting glasses) whenever she gets the opportunity.

In liberty,

M