100 yard scaled AQT targets

[mac66]

Was just up at my hunting property setting up my make shift 100 yard range. It occurred to me that it would be really fun to practice  100 yard AQTs so I started thinking about scaling the targets to that range.

Tell me if I have this right..

Standing would just be the standard full size D 20" target though I would probably just use the 4 & 5 ring since I already have a steel target in that sized.

For prone/stage 4,  I can use the 25 meter/100 yard scaled standing target

For stage 3/300 yard scale I could bump up the above target 25%

For stage 2/200 yard scale I could bump up the above target another 25% (or bump up the 25 meter standing target 50%)

Eventually I want to have a set of 100 yard scaled steel targets made.

[Oz]

Make the math easier on yourself:

Current AQT stage 1 - 1/4 scale of a full size D target
                   stage 2 - 1/8 scale
                   stage 3 - 1/12 scale
                   stage 4 - 1/16  scale

For your 100 yard range, you need 1/1 scale for standing, so right, full size D target is correct.
             Stage 2 you need 1/2 scale so 200% x the current Stage 1
             Stage 3 you need 1/3 scale so 1) that modified stage 2 * 67% or 2) current stage 1 * 133%
             Stage 4 you need 1/4 so current Stage 1 is fine.

Keeping in mind the AQT targets are very slightly undersized to provide a basis for the .30 cal rule.  But you only use the very center of the target anyway so this trifle will not bother you.   

(Edited to correct shameful math error.)

[Dude]

Go ahead and post a regular AQT.

equivalent 400, 800, 1200, and 1600 yds, just to say you did it.

It is a blast!

[Caliper]

Aww, come on Mac.  You've got a range with real distance, add in some comeups! 

Take the stage 1 size target and post at 25 (stage 1), 50 (stage 2), 75 (stage 3) and 100 (stage 4).  You'll have to do some comeups (or practice BSZ) and wind effects on a .22 are similar to centerfire at full distance.  Another benefit is that you can easily print this target on a standard 8.5x11" piece of paper... 

[mac66]

Aww, come on Mac.  You've got a range with real distance, add in some comeups! 

Take the stage 1 size target and post at 25 (stage 1), 50 (stage 2), 75 (stage 3) and 100 (stage 4).  You'll have to do some comeups (or practice BSZ) and wind effects on a .22 are similar to centerfire at full distance.  Another benefit is that you can easily print this target on a standard 8.5x11" piece of paper...

Come ups over 100 yards is good option. One more thing to play with while I am up there.

BTW, there is a place in MI that has good prices on metal plates.  I ordered enough in different sizes that I could the shoot the AQT at 25 yards with them. I ordered 7 3" plates for stages 3 & 4, 2-4" plates for stage 2 and a 8" for stage 1.  With shipping and tax it was less than $60.   I will have to stencil the targets on them and then mount them on some sort of stand. 

http://shootingtargets7.com/store/

They also have a IDPA torso silhouette that all the 25 meter Ds would fit on that may even be simpler and cheaper. One piece, just stencil the targets on it. I am tempted to get one of them as well since you could use it for other shooting.

[SteelThunder]

We ran a "drops at 100 for .22" at our January Winterseed.  Using 1020 fps stnd velocity ammo in 10 deg F weather, we found very large drops...on the order of 12-15 MOA.

At the May AS in Watervliet, 65 def weather and 1200 fps ammo, we tried it again and were getting much more "normal" ~6 MOA drops (the range was 4 - 8 MOA between rifles and different brands of ammo).

[mac66]

We ran a "drops at 100 for .22" at our January Winterseed.  Using 1020 fps stnd velocity ammo in 10 deg F weather, we found very large drops...on the order of 12-15 MOA.

At the May AS in Watervliet, 65 def weather and 1200 fps ammo, we tried it again and were getting much more "normal" ~6 MOA drops (the range was 4 - 8 MOA between rifles and different brands of ammo).

We've done a few events where we move the redcoats out to 100 yards to calculate ups for the 22. We move the standing target out to 100 and shoot it from prone. We then measure the drop and then raise our sights accordingly and shoot it again. It works pretty well.

Typically in warmer weather we get 4-6" drops with HV ammo. A little more with standard. That corresponds with the tables I have which indicate that a 25 yard zero gives us a far zero of about 57 yards, a drop of 1.5-2" at 75 and 4-6" @ 100. That means you would probably have to lower your sights to be on at 50 (but not by much) and then raise them again for 75 and 100.   I've done some shooting at my property to verify those numbers and they are pretty close. It will of course vary with ammo and the rifle used to some degree.

My goal is to simply put together something to practice and play around with. 

[mac66]

My steel plates came in the  other day and I've been fooling around painting them to scale using our AQT.  The small ones are 3" plates, so stage 3 & 4 will fit on them.  The stage two ones are 4" plates and the top one is an 8" plate. 



I really just needed them big enough for the 4/5 rings but wanted to see how much of the 3 ring I could get on them.



Still got to figure a way to mount them. Probably build a rack with cross bars to hang them on.

[2 clicks low]

These people make a steel stage 1. They will do full size upon request.
http://bobcatsteel.com/?wpsc-product=aqt-stage-1

2cl

[mac66]

These steel targets from shooingtargets7 are considerably cheaper and while not silhouette shape they can be used/ painted with at least the 4/5 scoring area.

Oz just came up with round targets for a match where they can't use silhouette targets. They are similar size to our AQT targets and now look like the perfect solution to my round plates.

https://appleseedinfo.org/smf/index.php?topic=41189.0

[Oz]

Mac, do these do the trick for your 200-300-400 yard plates?

[mac66]

Mac, do these do the trick for your 200-300-400 yard plates?

Yes sir, AWESOME

[mac66]

Ok, as to not start another thread, I am adding my target frame here.  It is to hold by metal targets in a way to simulate the AQT but only at 25 yards at this point.

Targets are from shootingtargets7.com and are 3/16" AR500 steel plate suitable for .22 (and 9mm according to them). You can also get 3/8" and 1/2" plates for a little more. This is for rimfire practice only. Cost of targets w/shipping was $54 & change. That includes the 8", two 4" and seven 3" plates for stages 3 & 4.

Additional cost was about $40 for the angle iron, threaded rods, nuts etc and two cans of paint.

Kind of a poor mans steel AQT training tree. Targets in the photos are hung using bailing wire, I am working on a couple ideas to hand them including S hooks or garden hose. Pieces of garden hose can not only be used as spacers to keep the targets from moving side to side but cut into strips ould be used as hangers themselves. Haven't got that far yet.

The bright side...



The dark side...I made it reversable so you can just pick it up and turn it around. It is angled so you don't have to stick it in the ground and the angle can be varied for terrain and so it won't fall over shooting the back/dark side.



it does fold up and the lower cross piece does not interfere with the lower stage four target when shot in prone.



Still tweaking the design but will be testing it next week up at my hunting property.

The other idea is to stencil D targets on them on one side and round, appropriately scaled targets on the other just for variety sake.

[Caliper]

Is this for rimfire or centerfire? Wondering if a 308 to the 100yd plate will knock it over?

[SteelThunder]

Targets are from shootingtargets7.com and are 3/16" AR500 steel plate suitable for .22 (and 9mm according to them). You can also get 3/8" and 1/2" plates for a little more. This is for rimfire practice only. Cost of targets w/shipping was $54 & change. That includes the 8", two 4" and seven 3" plates for stages 3 & 4.

[mac66]

Is this for rimfire or centerfire? Wondering if a 308 to the 100yd plate will knock it over?

This is for 25 meter rimfire only. You can buy heavier/centerfire targets but one would need to mount them on something significantly heavier and you wouldn't want to shoot centerfire at 25 meters even with heavier targets.

Still trying to figure out the best way to hang the targets. Garden hose will work, not ideal. I am thinking closed S hooks   Too bad Lapeer was canceled I was going to bring it Sunday to try out.

This is kind of a proof of concept.  Once I get this to work I will start on a 100 yard center fire tree.

Oh, and those thumb screws on the top two rods....I ran out of regular nuts so had to use what I had to hold it together. They will be replaced with lock nuts when I get around to it.

[mac66]

Done.

Homemade S hooks from steel rod bent closed and garden hose as spacers.

[Charles McKinley]

http://www.accurateshooter.com/shooting-skills/rimfire-tactical-precision-match/

There is a ballistic table for Wolf match 22LR at the bottom of the above link that runs from 25 to 250 yards.  You can use it for a starting point.  There are also some interesting targets to try out.

Your tree looks great.

[mac66]

http://www.accurateshooter.com/shooting-skills/rimfire-tactical-precision-match/

There is a ballistic table for Wolf match 22LR at the bottom of the above link that runs from 25 to 250 yards.  You can use it for a starting point.  There are also some interesting targets to try out.

Your tree looks great.

Good stuff, thanks.

[RODGE]

Wow, Stand.  Thanks for posting that link.  There's a ton and a half of info contained therein.  Gives me a lot of ideas that we may be able to apply to our local DAR.  And Mac66, that is a neat target stand and targets.  RODGE

[Charles McKinley]

WARNING: accurate shooter.com may consume large amounts of your time and reallocate large portions of your budget!

They have tons of good information and cool toys though!  I have posted that link on a few threads like the one for doing ranging for score.  The site has confirmed my high opinion of the .243 Win and made me desire an Eliseo Tube gun.  Checking out the Field Target airgun site will give you more interesting ideas and can lower you ammo budget.  Field target AS  (European Field Target guns are really high quality and $$$ to match) style would use the CMP daisy to do range estimation apply come ups.  A great way to practice / demonstrate KD concepts in 25-50 yards. (guns designed for 10m start to drop fast)

So where is the centerfire tree? 

[mac66]

So where is the centerfire tree? 

Here's part of it...

[shootingtargets7.com]

Hey guys.

Mark here with ShootingTargets7.com.

I shoot quite a bit of 22lr rifle myself (my favorite round to shoot) and if there is something you guys would like to see me
release I am all ears.

Since my company is mentioned in this thread I thought I would post up here and see if there is anything I could provide for you guys that
you might find appealing?

Obviously I am looking for items with demand, if anyone here suggests something and I decide to sell it you will get the first one for free!

Lets hear your ideas?

-Mark
Shootingtargets7.com

[mac66]

Hey guys.

Mark here with ShootingTargets7.com.

I shoot quite a bit of 22lr rifle myself (my favorite round to shoot) and if there is something you guys would like to see me
release I am all ears.

Since my company is mentioned in this thread I thought I would post up here and see if there is anything I could provide for you guys that
you might find appealing?

Obviously I am looking for items with demand, if anyone here suggests something and I decide to sell it you will get the first one for free!

Lets hear your ideas?

-Mark
Shootingtargets7.com

Mark, thanks for dropping in.  Since you are on the west side of Michigan you might want to try coming to an Appleseed to see what we are all about. We have one coming up in both Twin Lake and Niles in October.  It would give you an idea of how we shoot and maybe some ideas for products.

Having said that, you can see from my original post that I put together what I call an AQT tree. (I've modified it a couple times since those photos.   If those targets were the shape of "D" silhouettes  it would be more useful and fun, particularly for shooters to practice on.  I've taken mine to shoots and let students shoot them and everybody likes them, except for the shape.  Most Appleseed events include fun shoots where we try to lighten up a bit and have friendly competition.  I know at least one Shoot Boss uses a dueling tree as a competition and I was thinking of rigging bottoms on your 3" plates to use as knock downs or rig up as a dueling tree.

BTW, I just bought another IDPA silhouette  during the Labor Day sale. Having lots of fun shooting it.  A "D" style target of various scales would be even better.

[EEEE]

I think the 100 yard AQT target would be fine as a gong, but the 200, 300, and 400 targets would be more useful as bullseye targets because of their small size; unless of course you scaled them to 100 yard sizes like Mac66 did. 

[shootingtargets7.com]

I might be able to make your October meet to see what it's about.

Do you guys have any drawings or hard info on the targets you prefer to use?

A "D" style target of various scales would be even better.

Yeah these would not ship USPS and would cost about as much to ship as the target costs (for the rimfire versions)
most folks refuse to pay that unfortunately.

[EEEE]

Current AQT stage 1 - 1/4 scale of a full size D target
                   stage 2 - 1/8 scale
                   stage 3 - 1/12 scale
                   stage 4 - 1/16  scale

[mac66]

I might be able to make your October meet to see what it's about.

Do you guys have any drawings or hard info on the targets you prefer to use?

A "D" style target of various scales would be even better.

Yeah these would not ship USPS and would cost about as much to ship as the target costs (for the rimfire versions)
most folks refuse to pay that unfortunately.

More info  as to locations of our October shoots is here...

http://www.appleseedinfo.org/search-states-display.php?qstate=MI&statename=Michigan

Here is a link to downloadable AQT "D" targets to scale. Download, cut and trace for the dimensions.  The AQT is our qualification test shot at 25 meters.  My suggestion is to make them using the black (4&5 rings) to save material.  These are for fun practice after all.   

http://appleseedinfo.org/smf/index.php?topic=9833.msg83274#msg83274

I understand about the full scale D targets but a 22 version would be pretty neat.

Feel free to PM me if you need/want more info