Bringing .22 M82 Barrett and .22 M200 Cheytac to appleseed

[defcon]

appleseed looks interesting.  i think my wife and i would enjoy this since were still new to shooting

can i bring these .22LR's to appleseed? im looking at the Sunland, CA event in October. 

can we just do 1 day or do we have to do both days? 


.22 M200 Cheytac would be my primary.  .22 M82 Barrett would be my backup
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=z7-WKZE-Ops
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=AF9P70cbsv4






Wife's 10/22 HK SL8 primary and 10/22 M14 EBR backup
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-Yw8T2AY0Ko
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=o5OiP8pdqls

[2 clicks low]

As we say, "run what ya brung". Any will be fine. All need slings, GI-Web or 1907 Leather. You might also want to remove the bipod for the event as we don't use them (except very young kids who can't hold up the rifle).

1 day is fine. I recomend the 1st day as most of the isntruction is given then. 2nd is for honing skills taught on 1st day.

2cl

[techres]

They look on the heavy side.  I would advise you try to shoot them standing and make sure you can safely operate them in standing (especially holding the rifle's total weight with the support hand while operating the bolt with the trigger hand).

If the rifle, in it's converted form, is still 30+ lbs like the full one is, then I am not sure most people would be able to safely manage it in standing.

Try it before you go first.
'

[defcon]

As we say, "run what ya brung". Any will be fine. All need slings, GI-Web or 1907 Leather. You might also want to remove the bipod for the event as we don't use them (except very young kids who can't hold up the rifle).

1 day is fine. I recomend the 1st day as most of the isntruction is given then. 2nd is for honing skills taught on 1st day.

2cl

thanks ill look for a sling.  are we going to run around with our rifles?
can i keep the bipod intact but not use it?

we're going to miss the first day due to a wedding but we're going to be there on Sunday.

[defcon]

They look on the heavy side.  I would advise you try to shoot them standing and make sure you can safely operate them in standing (especially holding the rifle's total weight with the support hand while operating the bolt with the trigger hand).

If the rifle, in it's converted form, is still 30+ lbs like the full one is, then I am not sure most people would be able to safely manage it in standing.

Try it before you go first.
'

yea theyre pretty heavy.  it feels like its over 20lbs.  i havent weighed them yet.  ive shot them standing up and can safely operate them even with the bolt action.

i just need more practice shooting standing up.  ill bring a Savage MKII which its in a lighter stock as a third backup

[techres]

i just need more practice shooting standing up.  ill bring a Savage MKII which its in a lighter stock as a third backup

The weight will effect form and potentially safety.  The MKII is a great choice.  I would start with it and move up after you have the swing of things.

As for running, no, there will be no running.  There will be transitions where you begin in standing and then move quickly into sitting or prone - all while holding the rifle with one hand while using the other to support you going down safely.

You can leave any bipod on - it just becomes a foreweight, just can't use it. 

[defcon]

i just need more practice shooting standing up.  ill bring a Savage MKII which its in a lighter stock as a third backup

The weight will effect form and potentially safety.  The MKII is a great choice.  I would start with it and move up after you have the swing of things.

As for running, no, there will be no running.  There will be transitions where you begin in standing and then move quickly into sitting or prone - all while holding the rifle with one hand while using the other to support you going down safely.

You can leave any bipod on - it just becomes a foreweight, just can't use it.

thanks.

i havent tried doing transitions from standing to sitting and prone with these yet.  ill try it and see how it feels.

i read that we can switch rifles between rounds.  can i use the M82 or M200 during the sitting and prone rounds while i use the lighter rifle standing up?

[techres]

Switching rifles during an AQT is not something I have ever seen and it would be up to the Shoot Boss to be the final rule on it for a given event.  Since we have a special procedure for putting rifles on the line and pulling them off, it would possibly create a time drag on the event.  Normally one only swaps out a rifle if they plan to use it for a few hours or rest of the day.

The question is, then, why not just use the MKII?  It is a great rifle and well capable.  It would be superb to learn on and many a rifleman patch has been earned by that rifle.

The funny thing is that often, the simpler the rifle, the better the learning because it allows for focus to be put on the more important items: body control, steps of firing the shot, and so forth.

Now, 2Clickslow was right that we prize "run what you brung" and if you really want to use the heavies, the SB will likely be good as long as it does not become a safety issue. 

[defcon]

Switching rifles during an AQT is not something I have ever seen and it would be up to the Shoot Boss to be the final rule on it for a given event.  Since we have a special procedure for putting rifles on the line and pulling them off, it would possibly create a time drag on the event.  Normally one only swaps out a rifle if they plan to use it for a few hours or rest of the day.

The question is, then, why not just use the MKII?  It is a great rifle and well capable.  It would be superb to learn on and many a rifleman patch has been earned by that rifle.

The funny thing is that often, the simpler the rifle, the better the learning because it allows for focus to be put on the more important items: body control, steps of firing the shot, and so forth.

Now, 2Clickslow was right that we prize "run what you brung" and if you really want to use the heavies, the SB will likely be good as long as it does not become a safety issue.

i can use the MKII but honestly its just that cool factor of using a .22 M82 or .22 M200 to earn that rifle patch.   its something you dont see everyday and i think its really just the weight thats the main concern for everyone. 

[Pitmaster]

Get your patch with the MK11 and come bact to requalify with the others.

Switching rifles during an AQT is not something I have ever seen and it would be up to the Shoot Boss to be the final rule on it for a given event.  Since we have a special procedure for putting rifles on the line and pulling them off, it would possibly create a time drag on the event.  Normally one only swaps out a rifle if they plan to use it for a few hours or rest of the day.

The question is, then, why not just use the MKII?  It is a great rifle and well capable.  It would be superb to learn on and many a rifleman patch has been earned by that rifle.

The funny thing is that often, the simpler the rifle, the better the learning because it allows for focus to be put on the more important items: body control, steps of firing the shot, and so forth.

Now, 2Clickslow was right that we prize "run what you brung" and if you really want to use the heavies, the SB will likely be good as long as it does not become a safety issue.

i can use the MKII but honestly its just that cool factor of using a .22 M82 or .22 M200 to earn that rifle patch.   its something you dont see everyday and i think its really just the weight thats the main concern for everyone. 

[defcon]

ya you guys are right.

ill bring something lighter as my primary.

ill swap out my 10/22's into a lighter stock.

[SPQR]

It aint the arrow. its the indian.

[2 clicks low]

It aint the arrow. its the indian.

No no no. I don't know what shoot he's going to, hope it's mine. Wanna try out the Barret 

[defcon]

It aint the arrow. its the indian.

No no no. I don't know what shoot he's going to, hope it's mine. Wanna try out the Barret 

I'm in Los Angeles/Ventura California.  I'm planning to go to the Sunland event in Oct 7 @ Angeles range.

I can bring both .22 Barrett and .22 M200 for other people to shoot it there.  I just wont use it at my first event. 

[wcmartin1]

It aint the arrow. its the indian.

No no no. I don't know what shoot he's going to, hope it's mine. Wanna try out the Barret 

I'm in Los Angeles/Ventura California.  I'm planning to go to the Sunland event in Oct 7 @ Angeles range.

I can bring both .22 Barrett and .22 M200 for other people to shoot it there.  I just wont use it at my first event.

Hell, my AR15 A2 match-conditioned service rifle weighs 15 lbs. plus ammo, my M1A Super Match weighs 13 lbs. plus ammo and I shoot them from field positions all the time.  Don't be scared - bring them and shoot them - what better way to find out how effective you are with them and/or vice versa.

If they don't work for you using the skills we teach at an event, try something different.

If you can attach a GI web sling or a 1907-style sling, go for it - just bring your backup rifle in case you decide to switch for whatever reason.

Git-R-Done! 

[defcon]

ok i weighed the .22 M82 and its 13.2lbs. 

the .22 M200 Cheytac is 17.4lbs

.22 M82 is very doable

i tried the M82 in different field positions and im comfortable with it with the bolt release, safety, etc 

the .22 M200 Cheytac is also doable in different field positions where i can cycle the bolt but im kinda shaky.  i think i need to lift weights.

ive never actually used a sling on any of my guns so i have to buy some and see how it feels

[Padawan]

Find a way to 1.25 sling swivels and a GI web sling on it.

They call it a suggestion but I think it's a little more important than that.

[slim]

I used to shoot the 23lb M-60 machine gun (with 7lbs of ammo dangling over my support arm) from standing all the time.

Of course, I was a lot younger - but not quite as handsome - back then.


All jokes aside, all these "fancy" rifles that I've encountered on the line tend to jam up or have sight issues. In the true spirit of Appleseed, a "rack grade rifle" will usually serve you better at one of our events. All those gidgets and gadgets tend to cause problems and "cool factor" aside, it's a lot cooler to run a gun all the way through 40 shots than it is to run a couple shots and overcome a jam.

If they run well (especially after 200 rounds or so without being cleaned) then by all means, bring 'em. But a stock LTR is all you really need.

[defcon]

I used to shoot the 23lb M-60 machine gun (with 7lbs of ammo dangling over my support arm) from standing all the time.

Of course, I was a lot younger - but not quite as handsome - back then.


All jokes aside, all these "fancy" rifles that I've encountered on the line tend to jam up or have sight issues. In the true spirit of Appleseed, a "rack grade rifle" will usually serve you better at one of our events. All those gidgets and gadgets tend to cause problems and "cool factor" aside, it's a lot cooler to run a gun all the way through 40 shots than it is to run a couple shots and overcome a jam.

If they run well (especially after 200 rounds or so without being cleaned) then by all means, bring 'em. But a stock LTR is all you really need.

then you might like this one.

i have a M60 with a Ruger 10/22 inside.  full metal receiver, bipod, etc.  i have a 100 linked empty bullets that i use.  hehe
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=aSxkSSAlSOo


i think they run well.
i get jams sometimes only because im using cheap crappy bulk remington golden bullets.  the dress up kits are fine.   i do clean my rifles but i havent really shot them with better ammo.  ill be using cci standards and maybe federal bulk and see how they go.

[defcon]

Rest of my .22 conversions.  Most are full metal. Reset are plastic/polymer

Marlin XT-22 L96 AICS


Savage MKII F Blaser Tactical 2


Ruger 10/22 Archangel M1A


Ruger 10/22 Archangel Sparta


Marlin 795 L85


Ruger 10/22 AUG


Ruger 10/22 PS90


Ruger 10/22 FS2000


Ruger 10/22 Beretta RX4 Storm


Ruger 10/22 M14 EBR and Marlin 795 Tavor TAR21


Ruger 10/22 Bren and FND BAR



Marlin 795 Barrett M99


Marlin 795 SCAR


Ruger 10/22 AK47


Ruger 10/22 M249 SAW


Ruger 10/22 Beretta ARX-160


Marlin 795 UMP and Ruger 10/22 G36


Ruger 10/22 Super KRISS (making from scratch using sheet metal)


Ruger 10/22 CZ Scorpion EVO 3 (in progress. making from scratch)

_MG_3483 by defconskylude, on Flickr

Marlin 795 ACR

_MG_3636 by defconskylude, on Flickr


_MG_3634 by defconskylude, on Flickr



_MG_3632 by defconskylude, on Flickr



_MG_3630 by defconskylude, on Flickr

[slim]

Those are freakin awesome!

And as long as they don't jam, they'd be fine at an AS event. Just be sure you can use a sling with them and do quick mag swaps. Also - pick the one with the best sights!

[defcon]

can we use these magpul RSA and a single point bungee sling?

[fepowered]

can we use these magpul RSA and a single point bungee sling?

You "can" use whatever you wish so long as you are safe and do not hold up the line.  The issue is that a bungee sling will not give you the shooting position support that a standard web sling will.  Check out these pictures to see how a web sling is used to steady your rifle.
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  Appleseed is not tactical training and is not run and gun.  We teach the 3 basic unsupported positions of prone sitting and standing.  You could attend an Appleseed one weekend and attend a High Power match the next and feel relatively prepared. 
I encourage you to use a conventional stock on your 10/22 for your first Appleseed.   A conventional stock with a front sling swivel post and one which fits you properly will give you less headaches.  Hogue, Butler Creek, etc make stocks with a length of pull which fit adults.  Many people use the factory wood stock with a buttpad.
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  If you are fighting with your equipment, you will be learning less.  Since you are missing out on Saturday, you are missing out on the most detailed instruction on sling use and shooting positions.  There is still plenty of instruction on Sunday but Saturday is a slower pace for new shooters to the 3 positions.  If you are to get the most from your Appleseed experience, I would recommend that you keep the equipment simple so that you may focus on the techniques instructed.   

its something you dont see everyday and i think its really just the weight thats the main concern for everyone.

It is more than just the weight.  Between now and the Appleseed, get out to the range and try shooting at a 1" diameter target at 25M without a rifle rest in the sitting, prone and standing positions.  Your elbows may not touch the ground in the sitting position and no part of your rifle may be resting on the ground in any position.   It is better to figure out if your stocks will work now than to wait until you are shooting at an Appleseed to find that they do not work in this application.  If you honestly believe that they will work well, nobody is going to say you can't use them. 

[Bigcountry]

oh man my collection just doesn't seem that cool anymore

[defcon]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0KxlgcYn-HQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEXjuAnMjHU