Author Topic: 10/22 Stock for small hands  (Read 6433 times)

Offline jazcat

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10/22 Stock for small hands
« on: May 15, 2012, 10:52:47 PM »
Hoping some of the Appleseed ladies will have an idea of what i am looking for. I shot a stock Ruger 10/22 at the last Appleseed (thanks douglas34474) and it worked OK but the grip for me was very uncomfortable. I am only 5' tall and have small hands. The issue is the distance between the grip and the trigger. Because of that distance I am constantly "dragging wood" as they say. Otherwise my grip isn't on top of the rifle but wrapped around it.

I went to a gun show last weekend to see if anyone had a selection of the thumbhole laminated stocks I see on the internet as a replacement for the Ruger stock (I was going to say stock stock but thought that might be confusing ). There was only one person there and the stock he had didn't work either. None of the local or chain gun shops in the area carry a selection of these stocks unfortunately.

So I am asking the Lady Appleseeders here, what do you use? I don't want to go for the Tacticool stocks, I already have an AR-15 so don't need another one.  Gents, if you are also reading this forum please chime in too.

Thanks.
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Offline AuntieBellum

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2012, 11:04:34 PM »
jazcat, I have a question from your post.  Are you saying that you are or aren't dragging wood when you have your thumb on the side of the stock?  For all but a very few (and those are actually typically larger men with very large fingers), I've seen rotating your hand around the grip and keeping your thumb along the side of the stock work very well.  That's how I typically shoot, but I will admit that it's more for general comfort than for reach.

Offline jazcat

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2012, 11:56:57 PM »
Amazingly hard to find a photo of a proper rifle grip on the internet, here are a couple, http://www.umarexusa.com/pages/achieving_accuracy.aspx and http://www.rifleshootermag.com/2011/11/03/review-savage-model-11-lightweight-hunter/. The second photo, the man, to me has his finger way too far inside the trigger guard but you get the idea.

When I grip the rifle this way, thumb on top and rest of my hand on the side, it is difficult for my finger to reach the trigger.  My finger actually rests against the side of the rifle so I am dragging wood when I fire. If I rotate any more around the rifle I really don't have a solid "grip" on it any more. I was thinking one of the thumbhole type laminated stocks, with a modified pistol grip might work.
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Offline Nero

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2012, 12:30:41 AM »
You might look for one of the 'compact' 10/22s - they have a smaller grip area on the stock that works better for youth and women with smaller hands.  Shorter barrel than the standard model, but it doesn't seem to suffer for it - the one I built up as an LTR is wicked accurate.

Offline oladcock

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2012, 01:55:39 AM »
I took a youth model and put a Blackhawk Axiom stock on it. It's working VERY well for shooters of all sizes. Wondering how it would behave slung up tight, I ran 10 rounds down range you could cover with a dime. You can find them for about $70...O.L.

http://www.blackhawk.com/product/Axiom-RF-Ruger-1022-Rifle-Stock,1371,166.htm
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Offline RBKL

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2012, 01:53:09 PM »
I have small hands too.  I measured my trigger finger and it is about 2.5" long.  (Just so all you out there with long fingers can get a concept of smaller sizes).

Look ad AuntieBellum's avatar above.  You can see where she has the thumb on the side.  I think this is the first option to try.  (Trying something  different than what you are doing may not feel  comfortable to start)

What I do:  I have the hand shake grip, but I move my hand forward so the very tops of my fingers are on the front of the stock grip.   My thumb is up.    This moves me way closer to the trigger than if my fingers were around the stock.   I can still pull back to get a good fit into my shoulder.  With my thumb up, I still feel like I have a secure grip.

This works for me on my 10/22 (I have the model with the Hogue stock standard, and the shorter barrel -I believe the stock is standard size.)   
First- when you are making changes nothing feels comfortable to start.   Moving you thumb to the size may feel like you do not have a good grip.  It may be just a matter of turning your hand a little more and just getting use to the new hold.

When I pick up a rifle, a dummy riffle... I automatically go to the grip I use.  It is natural and comfortable for me now.  When I started nothing was comfortable.  It is just a matter of practice and getting use to what works.

This grip works for a 22.   I have a 30 carbine that I grip the same way.   I have not shot it enough to say if it works ok with the carbine recoil.  The 223 has a pistol grip so it is not an issue.   I can't say this will work for larger caliber recoil.   Just something to consider when you are trying different hand positions.

This is what I do.  More experience shooters may point out reasons why this is not the method to use.  If they do, listen to them.  It can be a struggle to change and you don't want to have to change again.
If there are no strong objections to this method, I will try and post a photo this evening.

Offline AuntieBellum

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2012, 02:21:19 PM »
I haven't had any problems with using this grip with larger caliber rifles, and I recommend it to a lot of shooters who are dragging wood or having difficulty engaging the trigger properly (even those who just have a habit of squeezing the rifle with all their might).  And that would be my only concern with getting a stock specially made for your 10/22.  It's great to have a special stock that fits you perfectly, but you may then have difficulty transitioning to other rifles of standard size.  If you're able to find a technique that works on a standard size rifle, then you'll be able to pick up any standard size rifle and be ready to put hits on your target.   O0

Offline aragornelessar86

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2012, 02:38:35 PM »
I fitted my mom's rifle to her recently and we ended up getting her a factory Youth stock with a shorter Length of Pull (LOP). LOP is the distance from the end of the buttstock to the trigger. What this does is it allows you to more comfortably rotate your hand forward/toward the support hand around the stock, bringing your knuckle forward and allowing you to bend your trigger finger more which brings it away from the stock. As RKBL said, look at Auntie's avatar picture. Having the thumb along the trigger hand side of the stock helps index your trigger hand to a position where you can get proper trigger and stock grip.

Factory Youth Stock:
http://shootersdiscount.com/cart/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=86

Aftermarket Youth Stock w/ raised cheekrest option:
http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=16635/Product/RUGER-reg-10-22-reg-YOUTH-STOCK
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Offline Charles McKinley

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2012, 04:39:59 PM »
As above I suggest putting your thumb all the way to the trigger hand side of the stock.

Everyone I have seen on the line with a thumbhole stock is draging wood BIG time.  The shape of the thumbhole seems to push the hand up and the trigger finger gets pressed into the wood. :'(  Some of these are beautiful (and really expensive) stocks but need some modification so to prevent this.

I know you don't want tacticool but my daughtes are using the ATI stocks.
Last evening, it occurred to me that when a defender of Liberty is called home, their load lands upon the shoulders of the defenders left behind. Just as the Founders did their duty for Liberty, every subsequent generation must continue their work lest Liberty perish. As there is no way for the remaining adults to take on the work of those that die, we must pass the ideals and duties on to the children. -PHenery

Offline aragornelessar86

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2012, 05:29:00 PM »
Everyone I have seen on the line with a thumbhole stock is draging wood BIG time.  The shape of the thumbhole seems to push the hand up and the trigger finger gets pressed into the wood.
In my opinion thumbhole stocks are a step in the wrong direction if you are dragging wood. Putting your thumb through the hole actually moves your finger further back away from the trigger. Try this exercise with a friend, spouse, whatever: UNLOAD YOUR RIFLE, sling up into position, whichever you please, but I recommend prone as it's more stable and repeatable. With your trigger hand, grab the stock like most people would, with your thumb wrapped all the way around the stock, finger on the trigger. Have your partner measure from your knuckle to the front end of your trigger guard. Now bring your thumb onto the trigger side of the stock, and turn your wrist like you're pretending your hand is a backhoe scooping dirt (but sideways of course). At first it will feel like you're going to drop the rifle, but if you're properly slung up you will not. Rotate your hand until your furthest trigger thumb joint is even with the back of the receiver, your trigger finger on the trigger, and your other three fingers wrapped around the stock, gently pulling the stock into your shoulder. Adjust to a stable position from there. Now measure from the same knuckle to the front of the trigger guard and you'll see that your trigger finger is further forward and closer to the trigger.

Maybe I need to make a video...
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Offline jazcat

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #10 on: May 17, 2012, 07:08:33 PM »
Thanks all, I really appreciate the responses. I will read them over in more detail this weekend. Darn work, gets in the way of all the fun stuff.
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Offline douglas34474

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #11 on: May 18, 2012, 05:21:08 AM »
Jazcat, the rifle you shot was a 10-22 Compact so you know how that fit.

Looking at the two stocks that aragornelessar86 linked to, the one from Brownells looks to be shorter through the wrist, which is where you need the stock to be smaller, besides the shorter LOP.

You may want to call Brownells and talk to tech support and explain what you need and see what they say.

We can always take a chain saw to the factory stock and make it work. There's always duck tape if we screw up. %)

Offline jazcat

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #12 on: May 18, 2012, 10:10:35 PM »
RBKL, I thought wow, 2.5" inches, that's tiny.   Then I measured my own Index Finger and it is, yes, 2.5" inches also.

Douglas, I haven't forgotten you, I figured it was my job to find a stock and then get you to put the actual rifle together. Didn't get a chance to call Brownell's today, will do it tomorrow. Also will probably go by the Gun Show, there is one in town tomorrow, see if anyone has any kind of youth stock to try out. Or even a regular stock now that I have printed the instructions from aragornelessar86 and RBKL, will see how those work.

Thanks again all.
"An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."
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Offline aragornelessar86

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #13 on: May 21, 2012, 06:07:49 PM »
I hope my instructions made sense. I'll try to make up a video in the next couple days that will make things clearer. Unfortunately all the theory is rotational geometry, which makes most people's eyes glaze over.  ;)
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Offline Miller

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #14 on: May 31, 2012, 08:53:44 PM »
You might drop a message to RC-Lori here on the forums and ask about the rifle she shot on Sunday at the Winterset event a few weekends ago.  After a couple of rifles with a poor fit she tried my loaner LTR with the Blackhawk! Axiom stock mentioned earlier.  Lori is also five foot and change and showed marked improvement with the adjustable Axiom.
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Offline Melissa5

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #15 on: June 06, 2012, 10:46:43 PM »
Check out a Ruger 10/22 ITAC.  I slapped a scope on mine and shot a 203 last weekend.  I've found that the adjustable stock and pistol grip work better for me than a traditional 10/22 with a wooden stock.  The only downside is that the ITAC is not really compatible with iron sights. 

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Offline Charles McKinley

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #16 on: June 06, 2012, 11:08:36 PM »
The stock on the ITAC in the above post the colapsabile folder from ATI.  It is ~$100 at Dunham's and they send out 20% off coupons like candy making it ~$80.  I have it on both rifles for my daughters.  There is no problem with Tech-sights and this stock.  A friend of mine has one set up with them.
Last evening, it occurred to me that when a defender of Liberty is called home, their load lands upon the shoulders of the defenders left behind. Just as the Founders did their duty for Liberty, every subsequent generation must continue their work lest Liberty perish. As there is no way for the remaining adults to take on the work of those that die, we must pass the ideals and duties on to the children. -PHenery

Offline Melissa5

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #17 on: June 07, 2012, 08:21:01 AM »
The ITAC does not come with a dovetail on the front of the barrel and is meant to be used with a scope or red dot.  I changed out the barrel to one that did have dovetails and could not get low enough on the stock for the sights to be usable. 
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Offline TomM1Thumb

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #18 on: June 07, 2012, 10:39:07 PM »
jazcat,

Are You going to be at the Clermont, Shoot June 9/10, If so You can try both of Teresa's(DeadEyeRed) 10/22's to see if either fit You, If not We will try there again at a later date.

Tom
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Offline Mark Davis

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #19 on: June 08, 2012, 11:58:31 AM »
There is a small rifle stock manufacturer who makes wood stock for small hands, the handgrip is milled to 75% of a standard stock and the distance from back of hand grip to trigger is also reduced.  I did business with them a couple years ago and have no link.
But was named "Wallis Forge" located in Texas.
Reasonable prices, good customer service, quick delivery.

Offline Nero

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #20 on: June 08, 2012, 12:15:30 PM »
There is a small rifle stock manufacturer who makes wood stock for small hands, the handgrip is milled to 75% of a standard stock and the distance from back of hand grip to trigger is also reduced.  I did business with them a couple years ago and have no link.
But was named "Wallis Forge" located in Texas.
Reasonable prices, good customer service, quick delivery.

http://wallisforge.com/

and scroll to the bottom of the page.  Looks like a small (one-man) operation.

Offline Mark Davis

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #21 on: June 08, 2012, 04:00:05 PM »
Thanks Nero,
It is a one man operation.

Offline Charles McKinley

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #22 on: June 14, 2012, 12:22:31 AM »
Xena did it come with the drop down tube for the but stock?  If not send me a pm.

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Last evening, it occurred to me that when a defender of Liberty is called home, their load lands upon the shoulders of the defenders left behind. Just as the Founders did their duty for Liberty, every subsequent generation must continue their work lest Liberty perish. As there is no way for the remaining adults to take on the work of those that die, we must pass the ideals and duties on to the children. -PHenery

Offline douglas34474

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #23 on: June 14, 2012, 03:46:07 PM »
Jazcat got the Youth Stock from Brownells:

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=16635/Product/RUGER-reg-10-22-reg-YOUTH-STOCK

This is a well made, walnut stock and fit her to a "T". Not only is the stock shorter that the OEM one, but the wrist of the stock is closer to the trigger group and smaller in size. IMHO, it's a great setup for those of us that are on the small size. This was a "drop-in" stock and required no fitting.

I was so impressed with it that I got one for my COMPACT 10-22 loaner that I built just for smaller shooters.

I want to thank Jazcat for taking the first step and ordering an unknown. I would recommend this stock to my fellow Appleseeders who may need a smaller stock to get a properly fit rifle.

Offline aragornelessar86

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #24 on: June 14, 2012, 03:55:38 PM »
Jazcat got the Youth Stock from Brownells:

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=16635/Product/RUGER-reg-10-22-reg-YOUTH-STOCK

This is a well made, walnut stock and fit her to a "T". Not only is the stock shorter that the OEM one, but the wrist of the stock is closer to the trigger group and smaller in size. IMHO, it's a great setup for those of us that are on the small size. This was a "drop-in" stock and required no fitting.

I was so impressed with it that I got one for my COMPACT 10-22 loaner that I built just for smaller shooters.

I want to thank Jazcat for taking the first step and ordering an unknown. I would recommend this stock to my fellow Appleseeders who may need a smaller stock to get a properly fit rifle.
Let's see it!
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Offline Melissa5

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #25 on: June 14, 2012, 10:16:06 PM »
Stand,  mine didn't come with a drop down tube.  Now I feel shorted.   !@#)  PM coming your way.
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Offline TomM1Thumb

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #26 on: June 15, 2012, 07:44:53 AM »
Jazcat posted a picture of Her New 10/22 compact in the Clermont FL AAR, I will repost it here
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Offline aragornelessar86

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #27 on: June 15, 2012, 04:27:30 PM »
That's a fine looking stock.
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Offline The Old Guide

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Re: 10/22 Stock for small hands
« Reply #28 on: August 24, 2012, 08:06:55 PM »
I bought North Country Lady a Butler Creek synthetic stock. I took the butt pad off and shortened the stock 1 1/8 inches. Then I raised the comb 5/8 inch by using half inch tubing insulation and black horse bandages. Next I added 3/8 inch to the front of the hand grip to move her hand and trigger finger forward and into the correct position without dragging wood. She likes it a whole lot because she got her Rifleman patch last Sunday with a 244!

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