Author Topic: IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?  (Read 1179 times)

Offline BlueFeather

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IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?
« on: January 06, 2012, 03:59:03 PM »
Hi Guys, I hope everyone is well.

Last year there were two emails sent out to ask everyone to re-up with Appleseed or to go to a page to do the same. Apparently not everyone got the news.  In the last week, those people who did not formally acknowledge that they were still in the program, lost their status... and most of their access to the forum.

Unbeknownst to me, you guys who I sent a PMs to, cannot reply to that PM!  You should however be able to post here as a newbie.  If you still want to be part of Appleseed, please post here and we will try to untangle the mess and get you back on board.

This is the list of people who did not formally say yes OR no, and probably had their access terminated recently:

JRICH          IIT0   8/30/2009
sistdog        IIT0   2/1/2010
spinner        IIT0   2/2/2010
Buck           IIT1   4/15/2010
flesheatingvirus   IIT0   5/2/2010
NikoTran     IIT0   8/11/2010
JohnM          IIT0   8/31/2010
Dafdov368   IIT0   10/26/2010
walker         IIT0   11/14/2010
Lead_Sled   IIT1   2/5/2011
Realhumvee   IIT0   3/10/2011
cwhamilton   IIT0   5/5/2011
ArchieL         IIT2   5/15/2011
Norm1057   IIT2   7/3/2011
freefyrefly   IIT4   7/30/2011
Theresa Genzling   IIT2   9/8/2011

NM Riflegal   IIT0   10/5/2011   (1 shoot in May 2011)
shooter       IIT3   10/21/2011 (5 shoots in 2011)
BobABQ       IIT3   11/14/2011 (0 shoots in 2011)
Precisely Advantageous   RH   11/21/2011 (0 shoots in 2011, 5 in 2010)
WindRider      IIT2   11/25/2011 (2 shoots in 2011)
JustJeff        IIT3   11/27/2011 (8 shoots in 2011)


If your name is on this list and you still want to be part of Appleseed, please post here ASAP!  If you know of anyone on this list who probably wants to stay here, please let them know and ask them to post here!

Sorry for the inconvenience in all of this: it was intended as a way to keep the board only available to active members.  From what I can see, a lot of people have not been al that active, but I would hate to lose anyone. 

And Shooter!! Where are you?

/Gillian
All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. (not Edmund Burke)

Offline oladcock

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Re: IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2012, 04:10:53 PM »
Gill, these 2 do not have access to the internet on a regular basis. I guess a computer and internet access is a requirement now days? I envy them! :) I know what they are trying to do but like the government, there are unintended consequences.  :wb: ...O.L.

cwhamilton   IIT0   5/5/2011
ArchieL         IIT2   5/15/2011
"The price good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." Plato 400BC

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Offline JustJeff

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Re: IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2012, 04:53:48 PM »
Gill, I have no problem working Alamogordo and El Paso shoots this year......but I will not click any link that says 'affirm,' because of one of the legal definitions of the word.   I have no problem, whatsoever, of confirming that I'll be active; and IMO that's the word that should have been used on the link.  I know, I know.... picking at nits.  But that's the way I feel, and I'm not going to change because I've been screwed by 'legalese' before.
Your version of "ineffective" does not necessarily reflect the truth....
Having been "ineffectively" taught to the Rifleman Standard and having been "ineffectively" taught to teach others to the Rifleman Standard, I believe I prefer the "ineffective" over the other choice.

Offline scuzzy

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Re: IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?
« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2012, 10:12:07 PM »
Here's from Bouviers 1856 Legal Dictionary (Blacks most recent revisions are considered invalid in some places):

If I read it correctly, an affirmation is much less binding than a confirmation, and doesn't violate Scripture as to taking an oath (let your yays be yays, and let your nays be nays, but do not swear under my name)


CONFIRMATION
, contracts, conveyancing. 1 . A contract by which that which was voidable, is made firm and unavoidable.
2. A species of conveyance.
2. - 1. When a contract has been entered into by a stranger without authority, he in whose name it has been made may, by his own act, confirm it; or if the contract be made by the party himself in an informal and voidable manner, he may in a more formal manner confirm and render it valid; and in that event it will take effect, as between the parties, from the original making. To make a valid confirmation, the party must be apprised of, his rights, and where there has been a fraud in the transaction, he must be award of it, and intend to confirm his contract. Vide 1 Ball & Beatty, 353; 2 Scho. & Lef. 486; 12 Ves. 373; 1 Ves. Jr. 215; Newl. Contr. 496; 1 Atk. 301; 8 Watts. R. 280.
3. - 2. Lord Coke defines a confirmation of an estate, to be "a conveyance of an estate or right in esse, whereby a voidable estate is made sure and unavoidable; or where a particular estate is increased."
4. The first part of this definition may be illustrated by the following case, put by Littleton, #516; where a person lets land to another for the term of his life, who lets the same to another for forty years, by force of which he is in possession; if the Iessor for life confirms the estate of the tenant for years by deed, and afterwards the tenant for life dies, during the term; this deed will operate as a confirmation of the term for years.. As to the latter branch of the definition; whenever a confirmation operates by way of increasing the estate, it is similar in every respect to a release that operates by way of enlargement, for there must be privity of estate, and proper words of limitation. The proper technical words of a confirmation are, ratify and confirm; although it is usual and prudent to insert also the words given and granted. Watk. Prin. Convey. cbap. vii.


AFFIRMATION, practice. A solemn declaration and asseveration, which a witness makes before an officer, competent to administer an oath in a like case, to tell the truth, as if be had been sworn.
2. In the United States, generally, all witnesses who declare themselves conscientiously scrupulous against taking a corporal oath, are permitted to make a solemn affirmation, and this in all cases, as well criminal as civil.
3. In England, laws have been enacted which partially relieve persons who, have conscientious scruples against taking an oath, and authorize them to make affirmation. In France, the laws which allow freedom of religious opinion, have received the liberal construction that all persons are to be sworn or affirmed according to the dictates of their consciences; and a quaker's affirmation has been received and held of the same effect as an oath. Merl. Quest. de Droit, mot Serment, 1.
4. The form is to this effect: "You, A B, do solemnly, sincerely, and truly declare and affirm," &c. For the violation of the truth in such case, the witness is subject to the punishment of perjury " as if he had been sworn.
5. Affirmation also means confirming; as, an affirmative statute.
persona non grata

Offline BlueFeather

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Re: IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?
« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2012, 11:15:42 PM »
Confirming or affirming should not be a problem, as the specifics are not mentioned, and quitting is always as easy as walking away.  ( The point of this whole event was to weed out those who truly were no longer interested. Yes it could have been done differently.) There are no repercussions for quitting and usually one just gets a lot of 'thanks for serving,' type posts in response. 

You're making it harder than it is.  That's fine, but you understand the consequences:  only instructors and students are allowed in front of the equipment line, so if you are not an official instructor, you may be limited in how much you can help.

Thanks for helping as much as you have: we all affect the lives of others in ways we don't envision at the time, so everything we do has value somewhere.
All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. (not Edmund Burke)

Offline JustJeff

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Re: IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2012, 11:26:44 PM »
Confirming or affirming should not be a problem, as the specifics are not mentioned, and quitting is always as easy as walking away.  ( The point of this whole event was to weed out those who truly were no longer interested. Yes it could have been done differently.) There are no repercussions for quitting and usually one just gets a lot of 'thanks for serving,' type posts in response. 

You're making it harder than it is.  That's fine, but you understand the consequences:  only instructors and students are allowed in front of the equipment line, so if you are not an official instructor, you may be limited in how much you can help.

Thanks for helping as much as you have: we all affect the lives of others in ways we don't envision at the time, so everything we do has value somewhere.
It appears that Appleseed has weeded out more than just those not interested.  Have a good year.
Your version of "ineffective" does not necessarily reflect the truth....
Having been "ineffectively" taught to the Rifleman Standard and having been "ineffectively" taught to teach others to the Rifleman Standard, I believe I prefer the "ineffective" over the other choice.

Offline JustJeff

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Re: IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2012, 11:28:52 PM »
P.S. Gill,
Thank you for returning my call, thereby making this less impersonal.
Your version of "ineffective" does not necessarily reflect the truth....
Having been "ineffectively" taught to the Rifleman Standard and having been "ineffectively" taught to teach others to the Rifleman Standard, I believe I prefer the "ineffective" over the other choice.

Offline George Hacker

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Re: IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?
« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2012, 12:37:59 PM »
I don't have a problem asking volunteers on a yearly basis if they are going to continue to volunteer.  Some of this is an automation issue (as Appleseed grows this will become much more important) and it is also a logistical issue for planning shoots.  No conspiracy here...

 :pop:
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Offline Johnnyappleseed

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Re: IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2012, 01:45:54 PM »
If the mission is truly to restore liberty to the nation, why is a 'loyalty oath', confirmation, and/or affirmation necessary?  This indicates some paranoid behavior.  It seems that everyone is needed, no matter how active...  Why are people being driven out?

Perhaps those who thought this whole thing up are walking away from the volunteers.



It's not a loyalty oath, it's a way of contacting instructors so that the 1000s of events can be covered .
I do not speak for Appleseed on this , but I think we should be required to sign  a loyalty oath .
What is stopping 5th column communist's , anarchist's and other assorted screwballs from destroying the program from within?
Every US military person and politician swear the oath . I think we should too.

It can be nearly word for word what exists now. I do solemly swear to protect the constitution ....
« Last Edit: January 07, 2012, 06:00:52 PM by colycat »
Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.
Calvin Coolidge

Offline oladcock

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Re: IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?
« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2012, 01:50:59 PM »
We've got a great crew here in NM and Tx. I whole heartedly agree the tone used to update the active roles left something to be desired. What happens outside of our area is nothing more than a pimple on mules butt. We KNOW you are committed to the mission when you show up and share your time and knowledge with others, nothing further is needed. But...They do need to remove those who are inactive from the forum, that costs bandwidth and man hours. Meanwhile lets look forward to a great year of awakening the sleeping giant! :)...O.L.
"The price good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." Plato 400BC

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Offline oladcock

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Re: IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2012, 01:57:25 PM »
AS, "and other assorted screwballs from destroying the program from within?"

That's the SB's, SI's, and MI's job to guide/lead. It's when we get away from instructors that are volunteers by invitation....Or we have social promotion has we have in our school systems, then we're in trouble. A better job could be done in that area....O.L.
"The price good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." Plato 400BC

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KD Ft. Bliss Tx. 214  10-19-2019

Offline Johnnyappleseed

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Re: IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2012, 02:45:57 PM »
Agreed --mentoring is the best policy --- I do believe it is possibile for some of the mentioned to slip through the cracks .

I heard about a  book some time back that proposed problems within the catholic church were atributted to  infiltration of a nefarious agenda driven group .

Once this group got in positions to control  seminary admissions they would keep out those of not like mind .

The idea of a loyalty oath should weed these out before even taking the orange hat .
What do we risk ?
Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.
Calvin Coolidge

Offline BlueFeather

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Re: IMPORTANT!! NM Crew -- Have you re-upped?
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2012, 07:32:21 PM »
P.S. Gill,
Thank you for returning my call, thereby making this less impersonal.

I don't know you and I never gave you my telephone number, although I make myself available online because I have a business, so it was easy for you to find me.  I did not return your call because you made your position blatantly clear... and then repeated it here. 

I started this thread to try to find anyone else who got lost in the shuffle, but meant to stay.

I thought I gave you a respectful and informative response.  But I don't get paid enough to be insulted.

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. (not Edmund Burke)