Another INGO memeber

[mammynun]

I'm looking forward to attending my first Appleseed with my wife and kids, probably Bedford in April. I have a couple of questions.
1. I own one 10/22 and it wears a 2-7x scope... I don't mind buying Tech sights if I need to, but my eyesight isn't what it used to be.

2. My 10/22 is the carbine version (barrel band); so I'm guessing I just need to replace the barrel band screw with a sling swivel and add a post to the stock? Or is there a better solution?

3. Is one .22lr appropriate to share between 3 shooters? I could bring an AR but my "research" leads me to believe that a .22 is the way to start.

4. Is there a place that describes the COF and has a *.PDF (i.e. printable) of the target?

Thanks!
Glenn Carter aka "mammynun"
KC9URW

[waveman]

Mammynun, first congratulations on wanting to come and bring your family to an Appleseed.  You will not find a finer bunch of people to be around.

On your first point, don't worry about scope vs. sights.  We have a saying " run what you brung " lol.  just make sure you have at least two mags for it

On point two, my suggestion would be to get the uncle mikes kit for sling studs for your rifle.  It has the option of putting a stud on the barrel band or a stud on the forend of the stock and yes put a stud on the rear of the stock as well.  If you're not going til April I would suggest buying a gi sling and purchase inch and a quarter swivels for it as well. one inch swivels wont work.

On point three, you will need a rifle for each shooter you bring ...sorry no sharing  but if you let us know ahead of time we might be able to have some loaner rifles available.  depending on the range you might be able to bring the AR but we do shoot almost 500 rounds throughout the weekend so it can get costly.

On point four, here is the cof 10 rounds standing 2 minutes 100 yard target,  10 rounds into 2 targets 200 yard equivalent sitting 55 seconds, 10 rounds into 3 targets 300 yard equivalent prone 65 seconds, and 10 rounds into 4 targets 400 yard equivalent prone 5 minutes.  on the second and third stages you will start standing will unloaded rifles you go into those positions ..load rifles and then proceed.  on stages 2 and 3 you also do mag changes ....refer back to point one about two mags .  As far as any targets go I would go to the appleseed store and purchase some targets for you and your family and maybe pass some around to friends and family and maybe get them on the line in the future.

hopefully this info helps you out.

sincerely, waveman

btw INGO is an awesome site

[George Hacker]

I'm looking forward to attending my first Appleseed with my wife and kids, probably Bedford in April. I have a couple of questions.

Glen,

Thank you for asking and trying to be prepared.  Thank you, thank you, thank you!

1. I own one 10/22 and it wears a 2-7x scope... I don't mind buying Tech sights if I need to, but my eyesight isn't what it used to be.

I used an inexpensive $35.00 air rifle/rim fire scope on my 10/22 because I have a stigmatism in my right eye.  Scopes are not a problem and sometimes older eyes require them.

2. My 10/22 is the carbine version (barrel band); so I'm guessing I just need to replace the barrel band screw with a sling swivel and add a post to the stock? Or is there a better solution?

Personally I use the 10/22 band swivel post and it works great for me.  I had to file down a band from a new 10/22 to add the post and still keep the band snug.

3. Is one .22lr appropriate to share between 3 shooters? I could bring an AR but my "research" leads me to believe that a .22 is the way to start.

A .22 LR is an inexpensive way to go.  You will primarily be shooting at 25 meters.  I would recommend borrowing rifles for the other 2 shooters to get the most out of the event.

4. Is there a place that describes the COF and has a *.PDF (i.e. printable) of the target?

Check out the following youtube video, it covers the COF: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aBeDOxUs6w

Hope you have a wonderful shoot! :-)

- ShadowMan

[mammynun]

Thanks for the reponses; very helpful.

I may have the rifle issue solved... my stepson has a 10/22 that I'm sure he'll let me borrow. On the other hand, he may decide to go as well (work/drill permitting).  Regardless, I'll probably use the AR and my wife and daughter will use 10/22's. I have a lot more time with an AR pattern rifle than a 10/22, so I may be better off with one anyway.  BTW, is recoil the main disadvantage to using a centerfire (mag fed) rifle? The weight? All of the above? 

[spitfire51]

The only real issue with using a centerfire rifle is the cost of the ammo.  Like waveman said above, you can easily end up shooting between 3-500 rounds of ammo over the course of a weekend.  A lot cheaper to do that with the .22lr, but if you're ok with that and the range allows it, by all means bring the AR out.

[SPQR]

Glenn,

I would like to introduce myself.  I am SPQR, your friendly neighborhood Shoot Boss for Appleseed events at the Bomb Range in Bedford, proud home of the Bedford Contingent.  I would like to take this opportunity to give you answers to your questions, straight from the horse's mouth, on exactly what kind of experience you are going to have.  I can assure you that no other person can give you inside information to the interworkings of this shoot like I can because, frankly, I am really awesome.

You have made a great choice for choosing Bedford as the location of your shoot but I must suggest you sign up as quickly as possible.  As the most good-looking and charming instructor in the program, I tend to draw a crowd.  Of course, there are other factors.  It is one of our very best locations and will fill up quick.  I can guarantee a good time because the range host and his guys are the best we have.  You will want for nothing.

The sight system you choose is the sight system you should use.  My eyesight is not great but I used iron at my first Appleseed and would not change that for a bit.  Often people find themselves able to embrace fundamentals far easier with the use of irons.  In fact, it requires it.  I have also discovered that longtime shooters often have a difficult time adopting some fundamentals is they use a scope at their first Appleseed.  Neither of those things are guaranteed to be the case at your first shoot.  I can say, from the depth of my vast experience, that Tech Sights are the bomb.  The TSR-100 model is the better choice starting out.  The TSR-200 often requires a taller front post than the one included and is more difficult to adjust for elevation in cold or wet weather.

the Uncles Mikes kit suggested by waveman is a good way to affix a sling.  A lot of times the kit that includes that piece comes with 1" swivels, a GI sling requires 1 1/4" swivels.  Fear not, though.  The instructors will have things to share should worse come to worse but since you have gotten on the ball you have a world of time to get rigged.  Worse come worse we will stick a zip tie on there to get it.  If your rifle has a metal band it will take some filing for band stud to work but a plastic band does not require the surgery generally. 

Rifles are nice but the only thing you really need is heart.  You gotta have heart, HEAR AR ART, miles and miles and miles of heart.  There wont's be time to share rifles.  We have run relays at Bedford in the past but that was due to the number of people who came and the size of the line.  that will not be the case at your shoot.  If you need loaners we can sort that out.  You will want for nothing.

Why spoil the sense of discovery?     You are going to have a great time.  We are going to do dozens of drills to improve your marksmanship and enhance your citizenship.  there is WAY more to Project Appleseed than the AQT.  You are going to see lots of different targets and have some really great experiences.  It doesn't hurt to practice, though, and for that just about any target will do.  If you want, though, waveman's advice will point you in the right direction to find targets.

[mammynun]

You are, in fact, really awsome. You are bacon-like in your awesomeness!


But my name is Glenn.




With that out of the way, I'm not sure how I'll handle the rifle/sight(s) issue. If I bring an AR, I'll shoot enough ammo to have paid for a second 10/22. And you can never have too many 10/22's. What I'd like to do is shoot the Arisaka T-99 my Dad brought back from WWII... but as cool and ironic as that would be, 7.7 is about $1.50/round. Other than the Arisaka, I've got a Mosin... 

[SPQR]

yeah, sorry about that, the effervescence of my radiance blinds me sometimes.  correction made

Tell you what, man.  The more we do these shoots the more we prove over and over again that the Ruger 10/22 and Marlin 795 are just plain old Darn Good American Rifles.  I have a stock Ruger with Tech Sights and it is just about the berries.  It has been rained on, snowed on, kicked around, HQ drove over it with a car and it just keeps on tickin.  It holds 2 minutes of angle no problem and the rust cleans off easy.  We have one instructor who was given an old 10/22 that was found behind the door of an abandoned mining camp in the American Southwest and he cleaned it up and it runs like champ.  They are just plain good rifles.  I love my AR, but that Ruger has a piece of my heart that I just can't get along without.  There is no shame in having a 10/22 if you can shoot the lights out.   

[George Hacker]

Glenn,

SPQR is an awesome instructor, but when you mention "bacon" ATM comes to mind. 

- ShadowMan

[ATM]

Did someone mention bacon? 

[Roland]

I just have one more thing to add: Practice with your 10/22. The controls take some getting used  to, especially that bolt release. So, practice changing mags, releasing the bolt, etc. If you do this you will have a big leg up on most attendees, and you won't get stuck when it counts

Welcome to Appleseed!

Roland

[George Hacker]

Since Roland is giving some tips I'll add another one to the list.  Have three magazines for each shooter - 2 for shooting stages that require you to change magazines and a spare as a "panic mag."  Preload the panic mag with a couple extra rounds and keep it handy in the event you have a misfire.

- ShadowMan

[mammynun]

I just have one more thing to add: Practice with your 10/22. The controls take some getting used  to, especially that bolt release. So, practice changing mags, releasing the bolt, etc. If you do this you will have a big leg up on most attendees, and you won't get stuck when it counts

Welcome to Appleseed!

Roland

I did the rimfire central bolt release mod before I shot the 10/22 for the 2nd time.  I have three 10rnd Ruger mags, and two 25rnd Steel Lips. It's zeroed at 50yds, so I need to get ot out and re-zero down to 25m. I haven't done much shooting from a seated/kneeling position, so that's where I think I'll start... then standing (which I've done more of).  I tried dry firing from a seated position last night and discovered I'm old, inflexible, and fat. But I met the Dali Llama, so I got that going for me...

[George Hacker]

Stretch daily and practice the transitions in the comfort of your own home.  Transition from standing to sitting or kneeling, establish NPOA, then dry practice.  Do the same thing for transitioning from standing to prone.  Hopefully that will help loosen you up a little.  It helped me.

- ShadowMan

[Barbie]

I'm by all means a newbie still but if I may offer an idea for your children (I was a teacher for 4 years... That "intruction" side of me must be resurfacing!)-  At my first appleseed, to demonstrate NPOA (natural point of aim) and how it is affected by our breathing & shifting of the hips, one of the instructors rigged up a laser pointer to the end of his rifle while "aiming" at a target... This may give a more "visual" aspect to teaching the kiddos NPOA before coming out to their 1st AS.  It's a great time, I'm spending my b-day weekend @ an AS next weekend... You'll have a blast

[SPQR]

  

Everybody settle down.

People have so much fun at Project Appleseed events, and they have such a transformative experience, that the notion of being able to communicate that to someone else is is simply impossible to resist.   

Glenn, I can tell you that you have nothing to worry about.  Your Bedford shoot is going to be one of the most zen, relaxing, dabba doo time experiences you will have ever had on a firing line.  Don't get yourself too wound up, you will just give yourself bad habits that we will have to beat out of you.

Bring as many or as few magazines as you like. There will never, ever be any cause to use the word "panic" at a Bedford shoot for any reason.  Every action we teach you to take will be one taken smoothly and deliberately with a calm focus and seriousness of mind.

The ONLY thing your need to prepare for and the ONLY thing you must have with you when you pull into the Bomb Range at Childers Farm is a teachable attitude.  You can bring other things with you, certainly, but the only thing we need from you is that.

SPQR
Optimus Maximus

[OhmsLaw]

Did someone mention bacon? 

ATM must have these boards wired so that alarms go off whenever someone posts the word "Bacon!"....

[ATM]

Stop toying with my Bacon alarm.

[Rimshot]

Whichever rifle the OP brings, I'm confident the ammunition will contain some variant of gunpowder, which was first described in the West by a Franciscan friar named Roger Bacon.

[AuntieBellum]

Whichever rifle the OP brings, I'm confident the ammunition will contain some variant of gunpowder, which was first described in the West by a Franciscan friar named Roger Bacon.

Shouldn't you be working while at work, mister?

On another note, I wonder if bacon grease would work well as gun lube.  Hmmmm....must go fry some bacon and try.  Even if it doesn't work, my rifles will smell awesome!

Oh, and back on topic - mammynun, I'm sure you'll have a fantastic time at Bedford.  Always good to have another INGO member on board.