Project Appleseed

I wasn't so concerned about target accuracy, the bedding makes the rifle much easier to reassemble, the chamber on this rifle was loose to an extreme (accuracy was always "plinker" grade), and I chamfered and polished the bolt to make operation a bit smoother for beginners. The trigger job didn't lightened it at all, just got rid of the gritty feel.

I'm looking at the Savage and Mossburg rifles now, the 10/22s are getting pretty pricey to built another LTR. Anyone have experience with either of those rifles?

DAve

Hi, Guys and Gals,

Rifleman here. I am thinking of combining a standard 10-22 barreled action with a Tapco extending stock to create a near clone of my ACOG equipped S&W MP15 Carbine. My old eyes don't do iron sights very well anymore and the ACOG is a great sight for my 16" bbl AR with just about dead-on trajectory compensation with the AE223N cartridge.
I plan on using my Bushnell Trophy 1x (ACOG look-alike) with the red/greem T-dot reticle on this new rifle.
Do any of you have any experience with a similar project?

Mountainman

Quote from: mountainman on February 26, 2009, 08:54:12 PM
Do any of you have any experience with a similar project?

There is always a first for everything...

Quote from: yellowhousejake on February 10, 2009, 12:22:43 PM
I wasn't so concerned about target accuracy, the bedding makes the rifle much easier to reassemble, the chamber on this rifle was loose to an extreme (accuracy was always "plinker" grade), and I chamfered and polished the bolt to make operation a bit smoother for beginners. The trigger job didn't lightened it at all, just got rid of the gritty feel.

I'm looking at the Savage and Mossburg rifles now, the 10/22s are getting pretty pricey to built another LTR. Anyone have experience with either of those rifles?

DAve

I plan to bring my USGI Mossburg M44 to the Appleseed.  I'm told that others have been successful if they have done enough advance prep work to be vey comfortable with working the action and maintaining their natural point of aim.  (I have some homework to do)

   I think most folks find the Tapco stock nearly impossible to get a decent cheek weld on. Try before you buy!

Quote from: eaglescouter on February 27, 2009, 01:17:44 AM

I plan to bring my USGI Mossburg M44 to the Appleseed.  I'm told that others have been successful if they have done enough advance prep work to be vey comfortable with working the action and maintaining their natural point of aim.  (I have some homework to do)

One of my local IIT's has shot numerous Rifleman scores with my Remington 513-T, and liked it so much he went out and bought one for himself.

I installed my TSR100 yesterday so I couldn't wait to get down the range today...

I shot my first group and it was a couple of inches high, so I reached into my range bag and pulled out my AR sighting tool...

4 pins, while the Techsight has more than that...

Darn!  Nobody told me that!

I thought I could use the AR tool, so I didn't buy the techsight tool...

The Tech Sight uses the A1 sight tool (five prongs), the new AR's with the square post (A2 sight) use the 4 prong tools.  DPMS used to make a dual tool with both A1 and A2 prongs; a useful accessory for an Appleseed Instructor in his shoot-bag.

Wow, I have done it!  I have read all 37 pages, I now feel qualified to make my own LTR.  Good thing I ordered the parts today...

OK, I'm officially annoyed. (go ahead and get it out of your system, JB... I'll wait)

Just went to MidwayUSA's site last night (while I was sitting on the couch watching TV, no less!) to order some stuff and found that the DPMS sling referenced below has been manufacturer discontinued.

Quote from: Nickle on August 13, 2007, 09:30:18 PMInstall sling swivels studs, detachable swivels and a USGI M1 Garand type sling.http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=777813 $10.29, black, also comes in green.

Anyone got an alternative sling that is comparable and not too expensive? I want to order a bunch to keep in my range bag for when I'm instructing.

There are so many invalid links in this discussion thread that we need an update with valid data in the first post!

Re: Midway slings:
item 777813 (green Garand style sling) is no longer available. The black sling (174603) still is available.

M1 style sling, new production from midwayusa.com:

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=1413174603

Green:  Discontinued
Black:  Out of Stock.  Backorders ok, estimated delivery 3/23/09

I have four of these nice and long

CJ Weapons M1 Garand Web Sling Cotton Olive Drab

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=966254

Status: Out of Stock, Backorder OK
Date Expected In-Stock: 3/16/2009

"Which 10/22 should I use to get started?  -- There are a lot of options: rifles, carbines, heavy-barrelled target rifles, even receivers that allow one to build a complete rifle with custom components.  One of the most-popular options for many adult shooters is a 22" barreled rifle from WalMart, available for just over $200.  Small-framed adults and children may prefer the slightly smaller 10/22 Carbine.  Any 10/22 is a good starting point for your Liberty Trainer."

Question:  Those of us in California have discovered that our WalMart stores do not sell rifles.  Which Ruger is the next best option for building a LTR?

I looked at the Target models with bull barrels, but they all lack a front sight.

In this case we would be shopping for an adult over 6' tall.

Eaglescouter

I have purchased a few Ruger 10-22's from Turners. Big5 Sporting Goods has them also, and I hear they are on sale this week (I have not seen the ad). There are probably a few small dealers left that have them as well.

Up In Arms in Fillmore, CA might have or could get.

Hi SavageShootr,  There are several rifle shops in town, plus the Big5.  The rifle shops are willing to order if they don't carry the specific model.

My question:  Which model should I be searching for since the Walmart version is not available? (I have used the Ruger 10/22 Carbine and found it to be too tiny and light for comfortable use)

IMO The standard 10-22 would likely be the best bet.

~SS

Some questions on sling swivels.
1.  The 10/22 available at Walmart uses 3/4" screws on its swivels, both front and rear.  The screws in the Uncle Mike's swivel set are 1/2 inch for the front.  Is that a problem? (It also looks like I'll need to get a set of screws to get one for the rear, also)

2.  Has anyone tried getting the swivel part out of the stock Ruger swivels, to salvage the screws?  That way, I just need the swivels themselves.  Is there something especially frustrating inside the screw that is holing the swivel in place?

3.  Is there a vendor with CHEAP shipping?  It kind of goes against my frugal outlook to pay almost as much for shipping as I'll pay for the part!

4.  Although I wonder what I'm getting myself into, is there enough interest in a group buy for a set of Uncle Mikes QD swivels, with 3/4 screws? 

Quote from: eaglescouter on March 11, 2009, 03:07:08 PM

Question:  Those of us in California have discovered that our WalMart stores do not sell rifles.  Which Ruger is the next best option for building a LTR?

I looked at the Target models with bull barrels, but they all lack a front sight.

In this case we would be shopping for an adult over 6' tall.

Big 5 does have them on sale this week.  The ad lists the plain wood stock model for $239.  I bought one in Simi on Monday, it rang up as $229, so they gave me the lower price. 

The shop in my local town has one for $275, but doesn't want to dicker about the price.

I have a Ruger 10/22, but I recently had my brother go to an appleseed shoot.  I have been before and he went to our local walmart and took a savage model 22 which cost him $117.00 dollars and he bought an extra clip and he was set.   I was'nt sure if the rifle would do ok or not,  but it did great.   This was in southwest VA.  My 2 cents.

Quote from: SkyDaver on March 11, 2009, 04:25:48 PM
Some questions on sling swivels.

1.  The 10/22 available at Walmart uses 3/4" screws on its swivels, both front and rear.  The screws in the Uncle Mike's swivel set are 1/2 inch for the front.  Is that a problem? (It also looks like I'll need to get a set of screws to get one for the rear, also)

2.  Has anyone tried getting the swivel part out of the stock Ruger swivels, to salvage the screws?  That way, I just need the swivels themselves.  Is there something especially frustrating inside the screw that is holing the swivel in place?

3.  Is there a vendor with CHEAP shipping?  It kind of goes against my frugal outlook to pay almost as much for shipping as I'll pay for the part!

4.  Although I wonder what I'm getting myself into, is there enough interest in a group buy for a set of Uncle Mikes QD swivels, with 3/4 screws? 

FWIW, I just buy the 1-1/4" Talon Heavy Duty Sling Swivels - although I have to go to a different Sporting Goods store a few miles away to get the bases for it. Tax is cheaper than shipping - so you now have an excuse to comparison shop!  And my 10/22 came without swivels installed, which suits me fine - I got to place mine exactly where I wanted in the wood. 

"Hold 'em, squeeze 'em and hit 'em!"

Well the cost and availability of ammo talked me into getting a 10/22. I really wanted to shoot my M1A and M1 Garand but I don't have a ton of ammo (1K per rifle) and thought I should save that until I can get more at a decent price. Here's what I got and the mods I made based on the first post in this thread.

Picture 1 is stock 10/22 rifle "before" shot, and picture 2 is the built rifle "after" picture:

Bone stock from the dealer:
1)



After mods:
2)


Items I added:

Green Mountain Barrel
Tech-Sights front and rear sight (front sight is a special slip on for .920 bull barrels)
Ruger 10/22T stock.
E&L Clip holders for 8 clips

I got the extended clip release, but I kind of like the stock Ruger one, so I'd be happy to pass this on to someone else. I'm waiting to get the auto bolt release part to fix the 2 handed bolt release issue.

I need to figure out how to align the front sight before thread locking the slip over sight in place. any thoughts?

Unfortunately the GM barrel came with some pitting and weird stain like marks all over the barrel. I may have to send it back or get a discount refunded :mad: I wonder if that's normal. I tried some steel wool on the stains and they do not come off.

I think it kind of looks like a mini version of my Springfield Armory M1A Super Match with the SS barrel. I can't wait to shoot it at Allemans next month.

Mooney

It looks great. 

A few questions:
1.  Where did you find the barrel in stock, and which length did you select?
2.  Where did you find the T stock at a good price?
3.  How is the cheek weld on this combination?  I'm worried that the comb is too low.

Talk to me about your excess clip release, we have a 10/22 here that has the nasty push button kind that is very hard to use.

Thanks! I may eventually refinish the stock in a darker color to resemble the old M1 style stocks, but for now it will do.

The trick to finding the barrel is being willing to pay a bit more for the version that is drilled and tapped for a scope. It's also only 18" long instead of 20 like the barrel i really wanted. I'm hoping the shorter barrel won't matter much. I got it directly from Green Mountain last week. They have the drilled and tapped versions in stock.

The T stock came from the rimfirecentral.com classifieds, I paid $75 for it. Was that too much? I figured with the going rate of $99 for a new aftermarket one, not in stock of course, that $75 wasn't a bad price to pay.

cheek weld is pretty much the same as the original stock. I can't feel much difference. Overall a slight bit thicker, but not noticable really.

I'll PM you info about the extended clip release. I wasn't aware of the push button style release, I was kind of confused as to why folks thought this was better then what I had. Now I understand, since I must have a newer and easier to use style lever.

Thanks,

Mooney

Quote from: mooney on March 15, 2009, 08:54:38 PMI got the extended clip release, but I kind of like the stock Ruger one, so I'd be happy to pass this on to someone else. I'm waiting to get the auto bolt release part to fix the 2 handed bolt release issue.

I need to figure out how to align the front sight before thread locking the slip over sight in place. any thoughts?

I think it kind of looks like a mini version of my Springfield Armory M1A Super Match with the SS barrel. I can't wait to shoot it at Allemans next month.

Mooney

Good looking 10/22, Mooney!  And yes, it does look (and, you'll find, handles) like the M1A.  One of the many reasons this is the default LTR.  I also have a dedicated .22 upper for my AR - but if you're a wooden stocked rifle kind of guy, this is the way to go.  And there's nothing wrong with training at 25 yards with smallbore - 4 MOA is 4 MOA!

Aligning sights - you need to find a buddy who has a rifle vise (or improvise something similar), and adjust your rifle in it until a vertical line down the mddle of the buttplate is plumb.  I use a carpenter's square and a small level for this.  Then you move to the front sight and position it so it is in the same plumb line.  I'm at work now - will see if I can get some pics of what I'm talking about when I get home tonight.

And yes, the 'issue' extended magazine release works just fine, but you'll be much happier with the auto bolt release installed - Christies' version goes for less than $20-

See you on the line!

Yeah, I'm kind of a "classic look rifle" kind of a guy. I like the old WWII rifle look. I played with my "black rifle" for so long in the Army that I just don't like the looks of them anymore, been there done that. I'm also hoping to figure out a way to embed 2 of my new Appleseed Challange coins in either side of my stock. I think the magic of the coins will help me shoot Rifleman at Allemans on April 18/19


FYI - I have to say Green Mountain Barrels has got to be one of the best vendors I've dealt with in a while. They are sending a new barrel out to me, after inspecting it closely for defects, and letting me return the defective one after the new one arrives. No hassel or issues at all and they were very aploigetic. Hard to get this kind of customer service these days so highly recommended.

OK, there's just no way to say this gently. The Shooter's Ridge swivels that we're getting (that are referenced in Roger's post on page 5) just plain suck.

I've had at least THREE die on my loaner LTRs. The cross-piece (the one that goes through the stud) just works it's way loose and falls out. Those things should be welded in, not press-fit. 

So I just ordered three sets of Uncle Mike's QD (Midway PN 774577) swivels and three sets of Outdoor Connection's (Midway PN 156955) swivels. I'll report back on how they hold up.

OK, edited that post on page 5 to use Uncle Mike's swivels.

I don't know if they'll be any better or not; I called up Midway and asked their advice. According to the nice young lady who took my order, the Outdoor Connections and the Uncle Mike's both had 5 stars from customer recommendations, so that's why I got both. I'll let you know how they work out as things progress.