Project Appleseed

Anybody know much about these rifles?  A local gunshop has one for $675 with a low-end bushnell scope.  The scope comes off.

My main questions are:

1 - Are the parts G.I. standard and interchangeable with american m1a's, m14's etc.

2 - Are these rifles up to snuff?  the steel, the tolerances, the barrels, etc.  This one looks pretty good.

Any other info is welcome.  Thanks.

Is it a polytech? If so all GI parts will fit. At one time there were problems with the oprod, but That is an easy fix. 675 FRNs isn't bad when you consider a Springfield will set you back around 1700FRNs. Or a Fulton 2800 FRNs

Kdan,

It depends on who imported these. Are they Polytech or Norinco? It would be one of these two if the rifles are Chinese.

Polytech = better  Norinco = not better 

Going off memory, Norinco has soft bolts and receivers (not hardened steel), are not compatible with US GI, Barrel threads not the same as US GI, and has cast receivers.

Polytech has forged receivers, not sure but believe bolt is ok (keep in mind, going off memory here), and barrel threads are the same as US GI, but you might want to re-check that. (I could look over mine but I'm not home presently, I'm back to the grind and in transit.   Be home in three weeks though, if you don't get a full answer by then from someone else!)

Polytech in excellent shape: $650.00 - $750.00

Norinco: not sure as I would never buy one...

DD

Oops, sorry Colonial, didn't see your post. 

We must have posted at almost the same time. 

How's that for responsiveness, Kdan! LOL! 

DD

Though most of this has already been said, it bears repeating.

Norinco - Don't waste your money. If all you can afford is in this price range, buy a FAL or M1 instead. Way too many issues to deal with, and once it's sorted out, you will have as much money in it as a basic M1A will cost.

Polytech - Well, these are fixable. Plan on replacing the bolt, as a minimum, and be prepared to accept that some of the work is going to cost you to get done. Check the M14 Firing Line forum and also Fulton Armory's website. Yeah Fulton is going to be biased, but, they are right on most of what they say.

My recommendation?

See if you can find an early Fed Ord M14A. I've got one, all USGI parts (except the receiver). No, it's not for sale. Sometimes they go considerably cheaper than a Springfield Armory M1A does.

Some folks will tell you a forged receiver is tougher than a cast receiver. That may be, but a cast receiver is tougher than a forged bolt. I know that from experience.

 Dan, make sure it has been hardened properly. (Receiver and bolt, etc) Heat treatment will double the cost and then some if you have to have it done. Check with some of the guys on M14 forums about such. All good avice above!  JB

I have one and I'd buy another one.

Ours shoots great.  Nothings broke on it so far.  I believe about the only GI parts that won't interchange are the gas cylinder lock and plug (metric threads I've read).

Some bolts are reported to be fine, some are soft.  I replaced the chinese bolt in this one with a used H&R bolt as the headspace was so great a field ga. would rattle around in the chamber with the bolt closed.  It still shot fine and I didn't know there was an issue with it till I checked the headspace.

If you switch to a USGI stock you may want to glue/epoxy a flat piece of aluminum or something else into the stock to insure the pin that locks the op rod spring guide in place cannot move out of place itself.  That pin is shorter on a PolyTech than on an GI or M1A rifle.

Did I say they shoot good, too.  After one Appleseed and one morning on the 25 yd. range at Ramseur my youngest son reported hitting all his 200, 300 and 400 yd. pop ups and half his 500 yd. pop ups.  Needless to say, he likes it (and he's named Mike, too).

Oh, yeah, you'll probably want to replace the chinese rear sight assembly with a GI rear sight assembly.  You can pick up complete assemblies on ebay for around $50 to $65.

Kdan,

How's things?

I'm checking Boston's Gun Bible and this is what he says:

Polytech=People's Liberation Army
Norinco (North China Industries)= 150 separate factories under a marketing agreement as a subsidiary of the Ministry of Ordinance Industries.

Chinese parts interchange with American guns: gas cylinder, bolt parts (not the bolt), rear sight group, trigger group and butt plate. Numrich has some replacement parts.
The Chinese barrels are good. Chrome lined but with metric threads for the flash suppressor, front sight, gas block.
U.S. barrels fit Chinese receivers, but not vice versa.
If considering a Chinese M14, check the headspace!
It absolutely must not bolt close on a NO-GO gauge!
The only reason to consider one of these rifles is that their receivers are made of forged steel, although left much too soft:

Ron Smith of Smith Enterprises really praises the Chinese clones after he heat-treated the receiver and machined it to accept milspec bolts. ( He reports no difference between Norinco and Polytech, so I stand corrected.)

That was excerpted from Boston GB.

The Smith work will run around $600. So for about 12 or 1400, depending what other do-dads you add, you can have, what these men consider, a good M14.

I hope this helps all here.

Regards,
MikeP

I have leanrt the following lesson the hard way more than once - 'cause I am hard-headed:

"You can but it once, or you can buy it three times" (The moral being - don't buy a cheap substitute - get the real deal the first time and save in the long run)

"The sweet taste of low price is long outlasted by the bitterness of poor quality"

And just like buying dive gear - I always like to remind the budget conscience of two simple words - can you say - "Life support?"

Thars my 2 cents worth.

Quote from: PHenry on September 01, 2008, 01:58:45 PM
I have leanrt the following lesson the hard way more than once - 'cause I am hard-headed:

"You can but it once, or you can buy it three times" (The moral being - don't buy a cheap substitute - get the real deal the first time and save in the long run)

"The sweet taste of low price is long outlasted by the bitterness of poor quality"

And just like buying dive gear - I always like to remind the budget conscience of two simple words - can you say - "Life support?"

Thars my 2 cents worth.

I collect M1a variants of many varied types. I have 6 Springfield M1As and 9 Polytech, ALL the Polytech have better accuracy and have had ZERO failures. My Springfieldds on average have been back to Springfield 1-2 times each.

There are no real problems with them. YMV