Project Appleseed

http://appleseedinfo.org/smf/index.php?topic=23970.0

Watch those squibs.

YHJ

A quick google brings back some good reviews. Was the ammo being kept in the sun? I know it usually seems to be and not bother other brands. I will keep my eye out for it though.
1200fps advertised.

Any reason for the heat effect?  Softens the lead nose?  Makes the primer more sensitive?

I have heard this mentioned before and wonder if physics here are understood.

Squibs = Very Bad
Federal = Squibs
Federal = Very Bad

Glad everyone is okay.

EDA: See clarification below.  Also, I'll still shoot Federal .223.  My AR really likes it.   

Quote from: AuntieBellum on July 18, 2011, 10:18:32 PM
Squibs = Very Bad
Federal = Squibs
Federal = Very Bad

Glad everyone is okay.

At least they pay for broken rifles?   

Some powders are temperature sensitive some much more than others. Usually higher temperatures will make the powder burn faster which will increase velocity and pressure.
I have never shot this ammo before must be sold at wally world. I don't recall, seeing it on the line before either though. I will watch for it.

I recall Hawkhavn saw wildly erratic velocities when Auto match was cold.

Yes the ammo was in the heat but not always in the direct sun. Two other shooters were using federal automatch, lying in direct sun all weekend without issue. I suspect it is temp sensitive.

After very close examination, I believe the primer material became overly sensitive and was igniting when the bolt hit the rim to strip the cartridge out of the magazine. All signs point to that as being the problem, and close examination of the cases and their final resting position supports that.

YHJ

Quote from: techres on July 18, 2011, 10:28:44 PM

Quote from: AuntieBellum on July 18, 2011, 10:18:32 PM
Squibs = Very Bad
Federal ammo = Squibs
Federal ammo = Very Bad

Glad everyone is okay.

At least they pay for broken rifles?   

Very true.  My statement is revised above.   

I'll just keep stocking up on CCI.

was a relatively tight chamber rifle, when switched to a factory barrel 10/22 the federal was fine, I would agree with YHJ that this time the issue was over sensitive primer, definitely would link to hot conditions

I'll just keep stocking up on CCI.

+1 on that CCI blazer is now the cheapest 22 out there and IMO the best of the bulk ammo

Quote from: AuntieBellum on July 19, 2011, 12:39:35 AM

I'll just keep stocking up on CCI.

I agree, I just can't find anything as reliable as 40gr MiniMag. The best comment I heard about ammo was from Restless, "CCI MiniMag is rifle candy".

YHJ

Out of Batterry Discharges are not unusual in .22LR. I would venture to say that we have not had a single AS (EVER) where there was not at least one. Usually there is no squib and no harm is done. Sometimes they will blow a mag out of the rifle. Others they will blow out the extractor and or ejector. Again, an out of Battery with a semi auto .22 is not terribly unusual.

On the other hand, a squib will make for a bad day and there is a chance of permanent damage to the rifle and/or shooter.

There are some things that exacerbate these situations. One is tight match chambers. Tight chambers can be a problem when you try to eject an unused round after a ceasefire. Sometimes the bullet is left in the chamber and you have the equivalent of a squib. Be careful with these.

But most of the .22's that we see at AS have limited OOB prevention. They will fire out of battery on occasion.

We also need to be careful about reaching conclusions that may not be related. This winter a couple of shooters had problems with ammo due to cold. Siglite was one of these shooters. Even if it was the same ammunition, we don't know that the results are related. We might finr a correlation of results without being able to affix a causality of the results.

We have access to good ammunition in the US. I would not worry about Federal Auto Match (I shoot it in a rifle or two and I have shot 10's of thousands of rounds of bulk pack). I have had my best accurracy with Eley Club and Remington match (white box from CMP in the 90's). But when I'm running conversions and generally 10/22's I look for high impulse ammunition such as Blazer or Mini-mag.

One last thing. If you are not already doing it, encourage shooters NOT to ride the bolt forward on semi-autos. Let it close with it's full force. It is both safer and more reliable when you do that.

Mike

Glad no one was hurt and that the shooter now knows to purchase a better quality round.

I think jmdavis's comment is interesting.  I have never seen an OOB discharge at an AS (with the caveat that I sometimes miss things from sheer stupidity). 

I also wonder about the root cause of some of malfunctions we have seen from ammo.  I believe that the root cause may be humidity fouling that takes place either in the factory or during transport and storage at stores.  I, personally, suggest the following method of bulk 22 handling.  I take all .22 ammo and immediately put it into my large ammo can (one of the big ones for 1500 7.62) with several desiccant packs.  It stays there for a minimum of one month.  The comparative results have been really positive. 

Most times you may not even notice the OOB. It may simply be that the bolt slaps back with abnormal force and the mag becomes problematic.  Or perhaps the next round fails to eject and you notice that you now lack an ejector or extractor. In only the most extreme cases (such as when the cartridge is not supported by the chamber) will you see results like those on the attached thread.

Mike