Project Appleseed

I found an article in the november issue of shooting times where the author was using lead (Pb) wire and spent .22 LR cases to swage them into jacketed hollow point bullets for 5.56 NATO catridges.  This seems like a whole lot of work but did seem like an interesting option if projos become nonexistent.  Has anybody tried this before or know anything about this concept?  Where would someone get lead (Pb) wire? 

I have seen a similar piece. Let's hope it doesn't come to that. I can't imagine they make effective,stable projectiles.

I have an Army Inprovised Munitions manual that shows how to reload primers and though "no way" now, who knows?

Its all part of the soft war Fred keeps preaching about. If we are reduced to these measures, I would say we lost that war. Sooo... Like I said, let's hope it doesn't come to that.

.22 cases into .22 bullets is old, about just post WW2 old.

And they shoot better than you would think.

Who sells the materials these days? Try the bullet companies. Also look for bullet swagers, because you'll need one.

Corbon (spelling) used to be big into that. My ex's uncle made lots of bullets during WWII and said they shot very well.   

I saw the same story, a little disappointment becouse they didn't cite sources for the gear and how mush it costs. 

Oh well got too many irons in the fire to take on something new, just trying to get some intrest in AQT and Appleseed with the makeing a living and keeping the howler from the door keeps me busy. Maybe someday.  If some one tries it I'd like a report here if they want to. :-* :-*

Rob

CorBon is the ammo company, Corbin is the swaging folks.

I haven't looked into this in several years, but Corbin sold all the stuff you needed. Measure out your lead wire, cut it by length, swage the 22RF casing into a jacket, swage the lead core into the jacket, canelure, etc.

When I looked at it, the prices were prohibitive.

Don't look for the price of soft metals to go down.

There is an article on it on ARFCOM.  I believe the setup costs around $600.  as I understand it you can only make 55grain projectiles.  My ARs dont like 55 grain projectiles very much and $600 is kinda step to make bullets of unknown quality IMO.

I can see that it is time for "Reloading History 101" again.

Does anyone know what RCBS stands for?

It says it all, though I don't think they make that equipment any longer.

Rock Chuck Bullet Swag Company.

One of the things they got their start making was the die and swage equipment to re-form and iron out the rims on .22 LR cases and then put the cores in and form the bullets.

This history lesson brought to you by:

Buckshot

Yeah, but how many actually remember them selling bullet swaging stuff?

I do.

Quote from: Nickle on October 17, 2007, 09:55:25 AM
Yeah, but how many actually remember them selling bullet swaging stuff?

I do.

I remember it being special order, then "no longer available".

I have also seen, and may have a few around here, I THINK Speer bullets, where you can still see the headstamp of the rimfire cartridge on the base of the bullet.

I did not buy them retail, they were shown (and I think a few given) to me by an older reloader.  And I am over 50 now.

Buckshot

I looked into this at one time because the idea of making my own bullets seemed pretty cool.

Then I found out how much it cost!

You can't use a standard reloading press, even if Corbin says it's OK, for very long anyway, as they are not beefy enough to take the force needed to swage the bullets, though I did hear of some people using them for a while before they broke. Maybe some of the old boat-anchor type RCBS stuff would last, but don't think the cheap Lee press will hold up. So, you're going to be buying an expensive Corbin press if you want to make a lot of projectiles.

Then there's the work involved. You have to collect your .22LR brass, clean it, sort it by maker if you want consistent results, anneal the brass to make it soft enough to form into jackets, buy the lead wire, cut it to length (or cast cores, also a pain), keep the machine clean and lubed, etc, etc, etc.

It's a ton of work considering that .224" 55 FMJ pills can still be had for around $60-70 per thousand. From all I've read, you do get quality bullets from the .22 cases, but it just seems like the time involved could be better spent elsewhere and I agree that if this process ever becomes a necessity, then we're pretty much FUBAR'ed anyway, so fight the soft war now so it doesn't!

Corbin's website if anyone is interested.

http://www.corbins.com/index.htm

Some neat gadgetry and presses over there, even if you never get into making your own bullets.

When I was in the Army my 1st Sgt had the Corbin equipment and did this.  I still have some 55gr HP bullets with the "R" on the base that he made.  They shoot very well, at least as good as the bulk pack 55gr stuff.

I wouldn't do it myself but if someone else is making them and giving them away I wouldn't turn them down either.

Hello Group; The cost of the tooling is not as important as you may think as they are tools not and not a  :-* novelty. The 22 case will give interesting results on game. Respectable groups on paper. No its not match and its not surplus but the raw materials cost is little once set up, you can run many cheap. The one in twelve twist in my 1979 AR shoots them well. Consider laying in a endless supply of projectiles cost Would be much higher than the tooling and the few parts that wear out over time. I guess I just enjoy each step I take in making the shot before firing the shot. CH makes Bullet swage dies for pistol Cals. AS always Pappy

QuoteYeah, but how many actually remember them selling bullet swaging stuff?

I do and still have some of it in the stash.
Shop around, it can still be found on the online auction boards and most especially at estate sales.
Never miss an estate sale.   Lot of folks don't know what it is and they end up in the junk die box at your local gun show    Also keep your eye open for something called a "core mold" used to cast cores from scrap when you can't buy lead wire.  Check into all sorts of "obsolete" reloading gear. You might be surprised at the things you find. One acquaintance recently purchased a Sears- Roebuck cartridge centrifuge, used to spin new compound into the rims of 22 rimfire cases so they could be reloaded.  They were available in the catalogs as late as 1915.


Buckshot, its Swage with the "e", swag are loot 

RCBS started that 22  business during WWII when you couldn't buy any bullets at all. Only 22, 30-30 and 12 ga #6 were manufactured for civilian sale/distribution and they were rationed.

As a youngster I had an opportunity to speak with 2 really great men, Wendell Fertig and Edwin Ramsey,
they said the best 30 cal bullets were made from brass curtain rods, powder from movie film and that primers were easily reloadable with material extracted from strike anywhere matches.  They ought to know since they managed to tie down 15% of the IJA for 3 years with no better materiel than that.
Fertig died in 1975, Ramsey is still alive doing veterans rights work.

http://www.corbins.com/diagram.htm

Not limited to 55 grain .223, sounds like ya can get stuff to make about ANYTHING if ya are willing to pay.

Not a way to save time or money, but worth its cost if the supply of reloading components gets cut off (like happened in WWII).  Also, you can make some pretty funky specialized projos with this equipment.  See:

http://www.corbins.com/bullets.htm

Looks like a whole 'nother world for technogeeks and tinkerers.

SoM

FWIW, Bench Rest competitors have been doing this for many years.

Many of them now buy custom bullets from Berger, Dixon and the like, but the origin of it is shooters making their own.

And, yes, you can make better than you can buy, short of those custom bullets.

Quote from: SamD on September 30, 2008, 12:51:39 AM

swag are loot 

Mnemonic I was taught long ago was "Sunderies, Weapons, And Gold" which was abbreviated on arrest forms under "Evidence" as "SWAG."  Probably apochryful rather than factual, but a handy menmonic.

I spoke to someone at Corbin that told me that he shoots the empty FMJ with no powder just primer in his basement. That is cheap shooting.