Thoughts on using a laser boresight during dry-fire practice for "calling the sh

[bigjimcalhoun]

I plan on doing a lot of dry-fire training in my basement.  I was thinking that a laser boresight (which I do not own and have never used) might be a good aid in "calling my shot".  By looking through the sights I might be able to discern if my shot jumps at all after pulling the trigger.
Does anyone have thoughts on this?

Thank you

[BaldDragn]

Here's an idea.

If you have an old CD writer laying around it contains a (working?) laser in it capable of marking paper (if mounted right and it's close enough to the target). http://www.metacafe.com/watch/756433/laser_flashlight_hack/

With a little work it could be mounted in a stock and a trigger used to make the electrical connection to a couple AA batteries.

It might work.

[eaglescouter]

BaldDragon, your idea, while interesting is highly dangerous due to the excessive power of the laser that is being used.

Please go purchase an el-cheapo laser pointer.  It is plenty bright, no modding required, and offers far lower risk of personal injury.

[Nickle]

Seems to me the way to do this would be to use a laser boresighter.

Already built, eye safe and cheap.

Add me for another recommending to NOT use the laser from an old drive.

I've worked with pretty powerful lasers over time, some that have an ocular hazard out past 50 miles. Those were Laser Locator/Range Finders for calling for Artillery fire. They are small enough to be carried on a soldier's back.

[atticus]

Big Jim,

You don't need a laser bore sighter and I wouldn't recommend that to anyone.  When dry-firing, you just need to practice STEP 4, of the six steps.  Remember, 4A focus your eye on the front sight.  4B focus your mind on keeping the front sight on target.  You should not be trying to focus on a dot on the target, that would be a terrible habit to develop!

Then, you squeeeeeze the trigger while still focusing your mind.  As the rifle goes "click", you call the shot.  Take a mental snap-shot then ask yourself, where was my front sight?

Good luck and keep dry-firing!

Atticus

[B9]

Big Jim,

You don't need a laser bore sighter and I wouldn't recommend that to anyone.  When dry-firing, you just need to practice STEP 4, of the six steps.  Remember, 4A focus your eye on the front sight.  4B focus your mind on keeping the front sight on target.  You should not be trying to focus on a dot on the target, that would be a terrible habit to develop!

Then, you squeeeeeze the trigger while still focusing your mind.  As the rifle goes "click", you call the shot.  Take a mental snap-shot then ask yourself, where was my front sight?

Good luck and keep dry-firing!

Atticus

Right.
IMO a laser bore sighter is good for one thing. A visual aid for shooters when explaining NPOA, effects of breathing, failure to follow steady hold factors, dragging wood etc etc...

[LavaTech]

I can't see any problems with building a pointer from a liberated semiconductor optical cavity courtesy of a retired CD/DVD writer, as there are NO "eye safe lasers" radiating in the visible spectrum which are typically in use; most are above Class II, and Class I is the ONLY "safe" classification. There are those that that won't immediately vaporize the fovea from a brief passage across your eyeball, but the spot size at the fovea results in around 1000 times higher intensity than the unfocused beam. It's been many moons since my Laser Technology/Physics classes from years gone by but the "no eye safe lasers" statement then is even truer now that outputs have climbed dramatically (in regards to what you are likely to encounter). Not one single laser pointer on this planet should EVER be considered "eye safe" regardless of distance even though the Class II's may be "relatively" safe at all distances, and Class III at 100 yards and greater as they usually won't have a collimated beam and do usually have a lousy temporal mode that results in a very large and diffuse spot diameter at that distance. Even the el-cheapo "pet toy" lasers may blind YOU,your cat, or your dog in an instant if enough care isn't taken to assure that the eyes aren't irradiated. Always respect coherent light.

The pointer is much too great a distraction itself IMHO; better off learning to use the organic instamatics if you ask me.

Forgot to throw this into my original post.....been a while since I visited this excellent site. ----[> http://hackaday.com/category/laser-hacks/

[bigjimcalhoun]

Riflemen:

Thank you for your replies.  My tech-sights arrived today from that place along with 3 slings from e-gunparts.com.  I just need a brass punch and some purple locktite and I am ready to put the rifle back together again and start practicing.

[Colorado Pete]

Jim, ditto what Atticus said.

If you are dry firing properly you should be focused on your front sight (if using irons) or crosshairs (if using scope). You will clearly see if they move at the 'click'. If you are using a laser and looking at the dot, you will be focusing on the target and not your sights, which is exactly the reverse of the habit you need to develop.

Good for you that you are dry-firing!

[LayloPro]

Hey all,

a bit of a "flare in the latrine bucket here".....

While I certainly do not discourage the use of dry firing for certain portions of the 6 steps (as noted earlier, 4a & 4b in particular, followed by 5 & 6),
one thing we have noted is the extreme success of having shooters use the "Mass legal laser blaster" by themselves, to actually 'see' the NPOA issues they insist on dragging along.......

Since the Mass legal has no sights on it, focus on -anything- isn't the issue.......watching the dot move while they adjust their "platform" is what this tool does best (and at all)......

Each of the steps has it's own primary point, & focus for muscle memory, until it becomes ingrained, & not even consciously thought of.......while I am certainly -not- the best shot here in this group, practice with -all- the various methods have enabled me to achieve relatively stellar results in my personal rifle marksmanship......amazing stuff, really.... < 

On a side note, I also recommend to all our students to spend 5-10 minutes a day with a clicker ball point pen as a form of trigger control exercise...(for step 5)... if this sounds odd, my old hapkido instructor once had us do nothing but open & close a common door, with the twist door knob for a solid month......but after that, any grasps being done were automatically set for a turning & twisting motion......and we could practice at home....

There is a laser pointer out there on the market that does not go "on", until the firing pin moves forward (calling the shot).....the problem I see with that is the amount of movement imparted to the rifle by just the mechanism going thru its' normal mechanical motions, & disturbing the POA......learning how to follow thru & "call the shot" when firing is definitely a focused point, & should be worked up to as understanding of the other steps increases.....

Remember, this is a journey....and the patch, or the desire to obtain the patch, is only the beginning step(s) in this journey.......

Shoot straight, & be well.....
LLP

[fepowered]

I plan on doing a lot of dry-fire training in my basement.  I was thinking that a laser boresight (which I do not own and have never used) might be a good aid in "calling my shot".  By looking through the sights I might be able to discern if my shot jumps at all after pulling the trigger.
Does anyone have thoughts on this?

If your target is small enough, and you are concentrating on your follow through, you should be able to call your shots just find.   One drill is getting into position, closing your eyes, inhale, exhale and squeeze off the shot then open your eyes again.  See if you are still on target. 
One of the most useful tools is a second person watching you......

[VAshooter]

Atticus is exactly right.

When firing or dri-firing your eye needs to be focused on the front sight. The only reason I would recommend a target when you dri-fire is so you can incorporate NPOA drills in your practice. Otherwise I would recommend dri-firing at a blank wall so that there is nothing to distract your eye from focusing on the sight. If you are looking at the front sight you will see whether it moves when the hammer falls.

Using a laser pointer to demonstrate NPOA or breathing is not for the guy down in position. It is for all the people standing around watching the demo. It's usually done with a rifle stock, not a rifle and so there arn't any sights for the "model' to look at.

VAshooter

[sgthoskins]

Big Jim,

You don't need a laser bore sighter and I wouldn't recommend that to anyone.  When dry-firing, you just need to practice STEP 4, of the six steps.  Remember, 4A focus your eye on the front sight.  4B focus your mind on keeping the front sight on target.  You should not be trying to focus on a dot on the target, that would be a terrible habit to develop!

Then, you squeeeeeze the trigger while still focusing your mind.  As the rifle goes "click", you call the shot.  Take a mental snap-shot then ask yourself, where was my front sight?

Good luck and keep dry-firing!

Atticus

I was thinking the exact same thing.  Calling shots is important.  Calling shots correctly is critical.  When the shot breaks the call is where the sights are on the target, not where laser is hitting the wall.   VAShooter made another excellent point, calling shots while dry firing is great practice, but so is checking and maintaining your NPOA while dry firing.