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10/22 Liberty Training Rifles -- Good for Appleseed AND for your budget!

Started by Grin Reaper, May 28, 2007, 01:04:16 AM

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Snake45

#480
May 30, 2008, 11:52:45 AM
I've never been able to figure out the use or purpose of those dohickies that clip two or four 10/22 magazines together. None for me, thanks, you can have all mine.
Buddy said "Coach, I wanna score goals"
Coach said "Buddy, remember your role:
The fast guys get paid to shoot and to score
Protect them, Buddy, that's what you're here for
Protection, that's what you're here for."

--Warren Zevon, "Hit Somebody," My Ride's Here, 2002 Artemis Records

Snake45

#481
May 30, 2008, 12:53:00 PM
Quote from: Arc on May 30, 2008, 12:19:22 PM
That's cool Snake45, you can send them to me!
I meant, I left all "mine" at the store. You can pick them up there.  ;D
Buddy said "Coach, I wanna score goals"
Coach said "Buddy, remember your role:
The fast guys get paid to shoot and to score
Protect them, Buddy, that's what you're here for
Protection, that's what you're here for."

--Warren Zevon, "Hit Somebody," My Ride's Here, 2002 Artemis Records

Junior Birdman

#482
May 30, 2008, 05:44:38 PM
   Since the purpose of the LTR is to train shooters in the basics and to mimic as closely as possible the MBRs, the purpose of the E&L Mfg connectors is to make the magazine hang down just like the MBR.  No more, no less, and it does this well.  If you have an AR it mimics the drop out or pull out. If you have an M14 it mimics the web of the hand pushing through the release and pushihg the mag out.  I don't know what the deal is with the one that connects 4 of 'em together though.   :D   JB
"But a Constitution of Government once changed from Freedom, can never be restored. Liberty, once lost, is lost forever." John Adams

Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have the exact measure of the injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them. Fredrick Douglass

Snake45

#483
May 30, 2008, 05:51:54 PM
Quote from: Junior Birdman on May 30, 2008, 05:44:38 PM
   Since the purpose of the LTR is to train shooters in the basics and to mimic as closely as possible the MBRs, the purpose of the E&L Mfg connectors is to make the magazine hang down just like the MBR. 
Just like what MBR? The 10/22 LTR is a fine little rifle in its own right but it doesn't come close to mimicking any MBR I can think of (M1 carbine with the early type pushbutton safety would be about the closest). I keep trying to tell this to the guys who want to spend five or six hundred bucks trying to make their 10/22s into "AR-15 trainers/simulators." It just ain't happening. You want an AR training rifle, build one up on a dedicated .22 upper, or at least put a Ciener or M261 into an AR.
Buddy said "Coach, I wanna score goals"
Coach said "Buddy, remember your role:
The fast guys get paid to shoot and to score
Protect them, Buddy, that's what you're here for
Protection, that's what you're here for."

--Warren Zevon, "Hit Somebody," My Ride's Here, 2002 Artemis Records

Old Dog

#484
May 30, 2008, 08:58:20 PM
As I've said before.  I've got down in a good sling supported prone position, gone through my NPOA drill, and I'm about to put some holes in the black part of the target, when suddenly my mind goes left because my trigger finger just ain't findin' that dang M1/M1A safety in the front of the trigger guard.  I'm so "stunned" I raise my head up off the stock to find out where that dang safety went only to realize its my 10/22,not my M1.

If that's not tricking your mind (pretty important I think) into believing you've got hold of your MBR, I don't know what is.

Recoil only matters if your position is weak and you have to reposition between shots (or after a couple).  I cannot remember a time when I was concious of recoil with an M1 or M1A except when it disturbs that sight picture.  After a few shots I don't even conciously think about that.  It's part of the process and I think my mind accepts it and ignores it as long as my position is strong enough that the sights settle back on the target.

To me that 10/22 is a great substitute for my M1 or M1A - for the process of firing the shot.  All the controls may not be the same,  all the reload steps may not be the same, but for putting the 6 steps to use, finding my NPOA and putting holes in the black, it's hard to beat.
"The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."

—Jeff Cooper, The Art of the Rifle

Old Dog

#485
May 30, 2008, 09:02:55 PM
quote "Francis Marion has a Ciener kit for his preban Colt Sportster AR15. I observed the groups, and they are not as good as .223 cartridge. Makes sense because a .22 round is smaller than a .223 round by about .002" or so.

Five or six hundred bacon cheeseburger frosties spent on a 10/22 look-alike could be spent on a AR-15 .22 upper. Waste of money IMO to convert the 10/22 into something it is not, and still not be something it is not.
[/quote]

My Ceiner in my CAR shoots "one torn hole groups" at 25 meters, ask crashkid2k, he's seen it.  Maybe it's the ammo, not the rifle.

My 10/22 trainer cost me a total of $220.  You don't need the special triggers, barrels, stocks, etc.  It's your money, but its not necessary to get a good shooting LTR.
"The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."

—Jeff Cooper, The Art of the Rifle

Snake45

#486
May 31, 2008, 09:10:52 AM
If you want a 10/22 magazine that hangs down, but not TOO far, check out the Ram Line doublestack 25 rounder. It works pretty well, too--not quite as good as the BC Steel Lips, but it works fine with good ammo (the BC Steel works better with marginal ammo).
Buddy said "Coach, I wanna score goals"
Coach said "Buddy, remember your role:
The fast guys get paid to shoot and to score
Protect them, Buddy, that's what you're here for
Protection, that's what you're here for."

--Warren Zevon, "Hit Somebody," My Ride's Here, 2002 Artemis Records

fepowered

#487
June 01, 2008, 02:59:16 AM
I don't understand the desire to have anything but a factory 10 rd Ruger Mag for the AQT.    Reliability alone should be enough motivation. 
"Today, we need a nation of Riflemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are
willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom."

Old Dog

#488
June 01, 2008, 06:49:23 AM
Since we're speaking of magazines, Midway has the Ruger 10 rnd. factory magazines on sale for $10.99 (blue color) and 12.99 (clear).
"The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."

—Jeff Cooper, The Art of the Rifle

Missouri Brigade

#489
June 02, 2008, 08:12:52 AM
I'm not getting anywhere using a brass punch on my front sight.  Any suggestions before I try to find a smith with the proper tools?  Thanks.

sidewinder

#490
June 02, 2008, 08:43:07 AM
I just installed my tech sights last week.
I think the instructions say to TAP the old sight out.  I think it was more of a WHACK to get mine started.  Comes out fairly easy after it gets started.

fepowered

#491
June 02, 2008, 09:15:22 AM
Make sure the barrel end is supported and drive it left to right.  A good wack with a hammer using a brass punch should do the trick.....
"Today, we need a nation of Riflemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are
willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom."

deolexrex

#492
June 02, 2008, 02:06:31 PM
Do I hear 27...

I attended my first Appleseed over the weekend and wanted to know where to get the front G.I. sling attachment point (I don't know what it's called, can ya tell?) that I saw screwed to the 10/22 stock. Anyone know?
DeoLexRex

The history of Christianity is a series of victories, described and disguised as disasters. Beginning with the cross... -- Herb Titus

Iron at 500 - AQT Targets

wtr100

#493
June 02, 2008, 02:21:27 PM
nothing fancy - cave man basic if most besterester
http://vets4fred.net/

Have your musket clean as a whistle, hatchet scoured, sixty rounds powder and ball, and be ready to march at a minute's warning.

deolexrex

#494
June 02, 2008, 02:30:03 PM
Quote from: wtr100 on June 02, 2008, 02:21:27 PM
nothing fancy - cave man basic if most besterester

Uh... what?
DeoLexRex

The history of Christianity is a series of victories, described and disguised as disasters. Beginning with the cross... -- Herb Titus

Iron at 500 - AQT Targets

Old Dog

#495
June 02, 2008, 02:42:12 PM
There is more than one way to skin a cat.

Some folks go to walmart and buy the uncle mike's sling swivel installation kit and just install those (get the 1&1/4" wide set of sling swivels so a GI web sling works).  The kit should have instructions telling you how to install the posts into the stock.  If you have a wood stock be sure to get the kit made for wood stocks (or if you have the synthectic stock get the kit for that).

I used an M14 front swivel which is attached to the forend with two allen head screws (the nuts/washers are countersunk in the barrel channel so they don't contact the barrel.)

Student used two US Enfield rear sling swivels (one screwed to the butt stock and one screwed to the fore end) on his 10/22.

There are probably more ways to do it.
"The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."

—Jeff Cooper, The Art of the Rifle

wcmartin1

#496
June 02, 2008, 02:46:39 PM
"Unhappy it is, though, to reflect that a brother's sword has been sheathed in a brother's breast and that the once-happy and peaceful plains of America are either to be drenched with blood or inhabited by a race of slaves.  Sad alternative!  But can a virtuous man hesitate in his choice?" - George Washington - from a letter to a close friend after the events of April 19, 1775

"There is no nation on earth powerful enough to accomplish our (the United States) overthrow.  Our destruction, should it come at all, will be from another quarter.  From the inattention of the people to the concerns of their government, from their carelessness and negligence, I must confess that I do apprehend some danger.  I fear that they may place too implicit a confidence in their public servants, and fail properly to scrutinize their conduct; that in this way they may be made the dupes of designing men, and become the instruments of their own undoing." - Daniel Webster, June 1, 1837

wtr100

#497
June 02, 2008, 03:00:33 PM
ok for the humor impaired - who's got a nice simple weaver base the screw into a 10/22 receiver?

ugh! ugh! ugh!

http://vets4fred.net/

Have your musket clean as a whistle, hatchet scoured, sixty rounds powder and ball, and be ready to march at a minute's warning.

Snake45

#498
June 02, 2008, 03:13:31 PM
Quote from: wtr100 on June 02, 2008, 03:00:33 PM
ok for the humor impaired - who's got a nice simple weaver base the screw into a 10/22 receiver?

ugh! ugh! ugh!


Weaver makes one. I think it might be called the T9 or T09. Very commonly found at gun shops and gun shows, all internet suppliers, even some Walmarts stock them. Only about $8. Cool thing about this base it that you can use either Weaver rings or common .22 3/8" dovetail rings on it.
Buddy said "Coach, I wanna score goals"
Coach said "Buddy, remember your role:
The fast guys get paid to shoot and to score
Protect them, Buddy, that's what you're here for
Protection, that's what you're here for."

--Warren Zevon, "Hit Somebody," My Ride's Here, 2002 Artemis Records

deolexrex

#499
June 02, 2008, 03:19:52 PM
I think this
QuoteM14 front swivel
may be what I'm looking for... sorry for the noob questions.

DeoLexRex

The history of Christianity is a series of victories, described and disguised as disasters. Beginning with the cross... -- Herb Titus

Iron at 500 - AQT Targets

MCKNBRD

#500
June 02, 2008, 10:36:56 PM
Quote from: wtr100 on June 02, 2008, 03:00:33 PM
ok for the humor impaired - who's got a nice simple weaver base the screw into a 10/22 receiver?

ugh! ugh! ugh!


The new 10/22s ship with a weaver style base.  I'll have one you can have when my Tech-Sights come in.  PM me your address.

Byrdman
Its better to sweat in peace than bleed in war.

Guns and Ammo...between them, they get all the money my wife lets me have!

muxtek

#501
June 03, 2008, 12:57:27 AM
Two things I bought with my LTR supplies were the sight adjustment tool and the rear sight rapidex windage knob (AR-15). I think I figured out the tool, (skinny end front, wide end rear sight). So the wider windage knob replaces the relatively flat knob on the right side of the rear tech-sight. That right? Any pointers? Which way does it go?

I received 5 steel lips 10 rd BC mags today. I plan to try them Wed 6/4. I'll let you know how they do.

wtr100

#502
June 03, 2008, 07:13:02 AM
Quote from: MCKNBRD on June 02, 2008, 10:36:56 PM
Quote from: wtr100 on June 02, 2008, 03:00:33 PM
ok for the humor impaired - who's got a nice simple weaver base the screw into a 10/22 receiver?

ugh! ugh! ugh!


The new 10/22s ship with a weaver style base.  I'll have one you can have when my Tech-Sights come in.  PM me your address.

Byrdman

hmmm maybe I'm asking for the wrong thing - the base that came with min is for a 3/8" .22 scope

I picked up a Barska red dot sight for the wife to use and the stock base is way tooo narrow

what am I looking for?
http://vets4fred.net/

Have your musket clean as a whistle, hatchet scoured, sixty rounds powder and ball, and be ready to march at a minute's warning.

fepowered

#503
June 03, 2008, 07:36:03 AM
You are looking for a Weaver style.  The last 2 new 10/22s I have purchased came with a factory mount which would accept either the Weaver style rings or the standard "tip off" .22 style mounts.  I just picked up a "tactical" style mount which more resembles a 1913/picatinny style rail.  It has more slots to give you more flexibility when mounting optics.  It was only $8 from Fleet Farm and I think it was Weaver brand.  I will have to check when I get home.   You can get the Weaver or dual style at any Gander, Sportsman's, Wal Mart, etc...
"Today, we need a nation of Riflemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are
willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom."

fepowered

#504
June 03, 2008, 07:42:40 AM
Quote from: deolexrex on June 02, 2008, 02:06:31 PM
I attended my first Appleseed over the weekend and wanted to know where to get the front G.I. sling attachment point (I don't know what it's called, can ya tell?) that I saw screwed to the 10/22 stock. Anyone know?

Brownells and others also sell a barrel band with a swivel attached to it in addition to the screw in style for wooden stocks which originally didn't come with one....
"Today, we need a nation of Riflemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are
willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom."

deolexrex

#505
June 03, 2008, 07:47:23 AM
I using a Hogue stock so I guess I'm going to have to use the regular 1 1/4 swivels.
DeoLexRex

The history of Christianity is a series of victories, described and disguised as disasters. Beginning with the cross... -- Herb Titus

Iron at 500 - AQT Targets

fepowered

#506
June 03, 2008, 08:00:15 AM
Quote from: deolexrex on June 03, 2008, 07:47:23 AM
I using a Hogue stock so I guess I'm going to have to use the regular 1 1/4 swivels.

You say that like it is a bad thing...    I use a Hogue stock with a standard 1 1/4 swivel and it works A-OK....
"Today, we need a nation of Riflemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are
willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom."

deolexrex

#507
June 03, 2008, 08:19:23 AM
Yeah, it will work just fine but I was looking for an attachment point with a little less "swivel".
DeoLexRex

The history of Christianity is a series of victories, described and disguised as disasters. Beginning with the cross... -- Herb Titus

Iron at 500 - AQT Targets

MCKNBRD

#508
June 03, 2008, 10:11:43 AM
Quote from: wtr100 on June 03, 2008, 07:13:02 AM

hmmm maybe I'm asking for the wrong thing - the base that came with min is for a 3/8" .22 scope

I picked up a Barska red dot sight for the wife to use and the stock base is way tooo narrow

what am I looking for?
Yeah, thats the OLD style mount.  I've got one of the new ones that fits standard or 3/8" rings. 

PM me your snail mail addy and I'll send it to you when my Tech-Sights arrive.

Byrdman
Its better to sweat in peace than bleed in war.

Guns and Ammo...between them, they get all the money my wife lets me have!

didactic

#509
June 04, 2008, 12:16:31 AM
Anybody who needs one and misses that freebie, try Natchez Shooters Supply #BQ915514 A $3.56.
"If not us, who?  If not now, when?"  Ronald W. Reagan
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