Osage Beach, MO Appleseed AAR

[Redleg13a]

I took some ROTC cadets to the Appleseed at Osage Beach, MO 13-14 October and it was very well received.  We had an outstanding time and learned a great deal about rifle shooting.  Marksmanship training in the Army is very different than the training we received at Appleseed.  One of my cadets earned his Rifleman patch using an M1 Garand.  (I'll take him next time...)There were 4 of us using M1's and two using .22's.

I first heard about the Appleseed through Shotgun News but never really knew much about it.  I always thought it was a bunch of militia wannabe's who got together to talk about the next revolution and how they were going to take on the world.  I went to this event a bit apprehensive about exactly what it would be like and whether or not it would be like I thought.  It turned out to be a group of individuals who wanted to teach marksmanship and build an interest in our American history.  They are concerned about the loss of freedom's we have and are currently experiencing, but they do not advocate armed revolution against the current government.  Rifle training is paramount.

Most of the day is spent learning the fundementals of marksmanship and doing so in a timed fashion.  Proper positioning, trigger squeeze, sight picture, breathing and safety are paramount in everything they teach.  Natural point of aim, something most people never hear about, is emphasized through various drills.  If you do it right, the 300 and 400 yard targets are not that hard to hit.  Pretty amazing when you can barely see a fuzzy blob over the front sight. 

I'm sore all over, my rifle is still dirty and I'm down about 250 rounds of .30 caliber ammunition, but I'm going to do it again.  My cadets unanimously said they want to attend another event and bring more cadets with them next time.  The training is outstanding and if you have a good attitude and come to learn, you will learn new things and become a better shooter.  I just wish there was another one close!

Grin, Guy, Son of Martha, and everyone else whose names I can't remember, great job and thank you for a great time.  Appreciate your time and effort in teaching marksmanship to a bunch of folks you don't know. 

Redleg

[Nickle]

Welcome on board, Redleg. Field Arty is probably my favorite branch. That and ADA.

Just so you know, Army marksmanship used to be quite similar to what we teach. Years ago, that is.

Us NCO's in some of the Guard unit's do use some of these same methods. I'm just lucky enough to be both an RWVA Instructor AND an Army Guard NCO (currently a 63B30 in an FSC, supporting a Fires Bn, M102's, soon to be M119A2's, we were an M109A5 Bn).

[Redleg13a]

Interesting.  I knew they used to shoot paper targets at 200 or so but don't know to what extent. 

I think someone was telling me about you this weekend.  Do a bunch of your guys do this stuff as well?

Redleg

[Nickle]

Well, I'm probably the only RWVA Instructor that's still an active member of the military. Not active duty, just Army Guard, but a drilling member.

My unit teaches some of the RWVA program as Pre-Marksmanship Instruction. We did PMI this past weekend, since we're going to do weapons qual next drill. Unfortunately, another unit (one of the firing batteries) is running the ranges. We'll see what they think of G Co's troops getting into a proper position, and using slings.

I've run the range for the unit a few times as Range Officer (yeah, an E-6 Range Officer, but, I've been an E-7 in other units, and the Guard is far more open minded than the RA). THe most recent was earlier this year, Weapons Qual Make-Up, so I got all those that couldn't qualify last fall. Got most of them through, some made a LOT of improvement, once their shooting position was changed, the basics hammered into them, and after some effective coaching. Had a couple of Line NCO's that could shoot (again, Guards, so they were E-4's that can shoot well), and they did a great job.

I generally key on the real basics, as I have far less than 2 days to get them through. The 6 steps, NPOA, sling and shooting position are the big ones. Watching and evaluating their groups on the zero phase (talking targets) is also used.

[cmidkiff]

My daughter Kimberly and I thoroughly enjoyed ourselves at this event.  Kimberly's only exposure to rifle shooting was benched target rifles, with a bi pod and a big scope, or tube feed 'plinkers' with rudimentary sights. At least she was comfortable with safe handling practices and knows basic range etiquette.  By Sunday afternoon, she was out scoring me, and was demonstrating much better form at the line.  Youth and flexibility (as well as a lack of bad habits) has it's advantages, I guess. 

I want to thank all the instructors who spent time helping my daughter get the most from this experience.  Instructors at this event went to the trouble of finding a spare 10/22 stock, cutting it to Kimberly's size, moving sling swivels to fit her better, reshaping the butt pad, and installing it on her rifle.  No charge... just happy to help.  You couldn't ask for instructors to make more effort than these people did.  Any question or problem she was having was quickly resolved, and she received a great deal of personal coaching on position, breath control, trigger control, and follow through.  I want to make sure that you all know how much I appreciate the effort.  I have no doubt that she'll soon be shooting rifleman, it's going to be a race to see if she gets there before I do!

It was good to see the ROTC guys there... I don't know how common it is to have a contingent of future soldiers at these events, but I was not expecting it.

I didn't get a comment card, so I'm going to make a couple suggestions here for people to look over.  Please take these in the spirit they are offered, and ideas that might make others experience even more positive than my own has been...

1) The thread on the Osage appleseed (http://appleseedinfo.org/smf/index.php?topic=156.0) was closed from the first time that I had seen it, months ago.  It would have been nice if we could have posted comments and questions to that thread prior to the event.  Even without input from instructors, the people who were planning to attend could have used the thread to share ideas and get to know each other some prior to the event.

2) Details on the weekend were sparse.  For example, I did not know until we arrived that lunch could be purchased at the range (good food, at a very fair price).  It's great that it was available, but I could have saved a few bucks if I'd have known about it.  A good map of the location, showing the campsite, portajons, range, lunch locations, etc. would have been invaluable, as well.

3) Information on Appleseed events is scattered across the internet.  In order to find out the information that I did get, I ended up at fredsm14stocks.com, rwva.org, AppleseedInfo.org, and Liberty's Price, among other sights, digging for information.  I'm a serious computer geek... I'm wondering how someone less computer literate could ever have found the information.

Those issues are minimal when compared to the rest of my experience at this event.  This has been an overwhelmingly positive experience, and I expect to be attending more events in the future.

If anyone is interested, please feel free to stop by MissouriCarry.com and share your experience with our group.  I'm quite sure that there will be many more MoCarry people at the next Missouri Appleseed.

[Nickle]

I forgot to mention that it will be good to know we'll have some officers that know how to shoot well. Never a bad thing, for sure.

[Old Dog]

Please, after you teach 'em to shoot, teach to read a map and use a compass.  Some day a bunch of cold, wet and tired enlisted men you've never met will silently give thanks when they find out their new butterbar isn't getting them lost after all - and you will be responsible.

[rangerron]

I was on the firing line at Osage Beach, next to the Army ROTC guys. Great bunch of young men. There is still hope.

Militia guys do not go to Appleseed, they are too busy trying to hide, instead of getting involved now in the political and social process.

[Fish in a Barrel]

This was my first event as well.  Boy did I learn a lot!  Honestly, I thought I'd do pretty well since I shoot well off the bench.  Yeah... I can hear you all chuckling after reading that. I need to make some equipment adjustments and practice, practice, practice so I'm ready for the next shoot!

It's amazing how quickly the time (and ammo) go during the shoot.  My hips, side, and shoulders are all complaining about the abuse they took.

The instructors and land-owners who donated their time, expertise, and property for this event are all doing an amazing thing.

[Simballo]

I too attended the Osage Beach, MO Appleseed this weekend.

Let me first thank all of the instructors for their unpaid time and effort in teaching the fundamentals of rifle shooting.

Next, a big "Thank You" to the land owner for allowing us to use his farm for the event.

Lastly, a "Thank You" to all of the participants for making this an enjoyable experience.

I could only work one day of the event into my schedule for the weekend.

I arrived early Friday night where I was greeted by Guy "The Guy" and introduced to the recent Boot Camp graduates whom would be our instructors for Saturday.

Although the actual program didn't start until Saturday, Guy offer to introduce me to the range that evening so after the 60 second safety talk we were off to the range.

I've no rifle experience beyond the Boy Scout rifle merit badge so my experience is limited. (I had no idea just how limited at this point.)

In less than 10 minutes Guy had introdued me to the sling, its use, the six steps to firing a shot, and was coaching my technique.

If I'd left at that point, the entire 5 hour drive to the event would have been worth it. Thanks Guy.

I learned more in an hour than I'd managed to learn in 49 years on my own.

Several other instructors help me that night. Kary gunsmithed my iron sights and Wrong Way donated a pair of knee pads. Thanks to both of you.

I think every other instructor coached me in some way Saturday. It was sure a lot of good advice. I appreciate all of the sincere advice, suggestions, and criticism.

While I didn't break triple digits on my qualification shooting, I did surpass the goal I'd set for myself... Introduce myself to a quality shooting program.

Somewhere during all of the cool temps, rain, and fighting the sling I learned how to hold the rifle pretty steady. The really odd part was that it requires almost no muscle tension. The sling does it all! The sling along with the relaxed left hand and the shoulder pocket held the gun solidly. My right hand was freed from holding the rifle and now only had to squeeeeze the trigger.

I remember so other poster saying they didn't know how they'd ever used a rifle without a sling before and now I understand that statement.

Once I'd found this, NPOA, and the standing and sitting positions were a lot easier.

The most enjoyable experience were the lunches and evening campfires where I got to know the instructors and people whom I'd been learning with on the range that day.

I'm practicing what I learned this weekend each night and plan on working the Evansville, IN Appleseed event into my schedule.

Maybe I'll be a rifleman next year and maybe still a cook, but I'll be better than I was before the program.

Thanks again to all whom made this an enjoyable learning experience.

Gary

[WrongWay]

Hello everyone!

I am very pleased to say that i just returned from a weeklong bootcamp and weekend appleseed. I was surrounded by peeps who shared a common love of our great country, our people, our beliefs in the law of the land, and the 2nd amendment.

I was pleased to share the line with future leaders of our military, fathers with their children, and the young and old from all walks of life, who shared a common interest , shooting!

Cmidkiff had some good suggestions about the computer link and the fact that it did not work (lol), and it was difficult to get info prior to the event. Other than that minor gif, i thought things went smoothly and should stay pretty much the same.

The Guy, Grin Reaper, and Son of Martha, were very professional and made everyone feel welcome and special.

Keep up the great work! I look forward to many more appleseeds and bootcamps.

Wrongway

[Flathead]

One of my intial thoughts when I first heard of the appleseed program was of the Tin Foil hat crowd, but almost every one that attends these shoots are the same type of person you would just enjoy their company and getting to know one another better.
Freindships are formed that last for a long time and u  can't wait until the nest shoot to get to see them again and pick their brain
Glad this event turned out good for all who made it there!!! And to the people that brought their offspring Thank You very much for passing on a tradition that needs the shot in the arm!

[The Guy]

To begin with, it was great meeting all of the weekend shooters at the Appleseed.

We had a total of 44 over the two days.

Pretty good for an event that just a few weeks ago was looking pretty sparse.

Bob and Jason, thanks for the land.

Kerry, thanks for the food and for helping to ramrod this thing.

WrongWay, Scooter, Ruben, Dan, and Pat, welcome to the Ranks of Instructors.

SoM and Grin, hey, thanks for traveling from GA to help out.

Rick and Danny,  thanks as well.  I can't wait for the Arkahoma seed next year.

After a bit of rain on Sat morning, we had nice as could be weather for a very enjoyable weekend.

There were only 2 Riflemen produced durring the weekend, disapointingly enough, but if the rest Persevere, Adapt and Overcome, then the next one (already planned) should produce quite a few.  So many were alomst there.....

-sigh-

Having the ROTC boys was a nice touch, along with the two father/child groups.  Plus, anytime a tree falls behind the targets, you know that fun is being had.

I certainly hope I can be back next year.

Of course, I hope I can make it back to ALL Appleseeds for the follow up shoot, so that last statement should come as no suprise.  LOL

Now I'm all primed for Evansville IN.

Maybe I will see a few of you there!

Guy

[smle]

I was one of those forty some odd people this weekend at Osage Beach, along with my daughter(Shevy) and her husband(Shever). And I had a fantastic time. Guy,SoM and Grin Reaper made things run smooth and the new instructors were absolutely great. I'll have to go back and get their names for my article. On that note I'd prefer to use your forum names in the article, please e-mail me your forum names. As far as my shooting went, well...., I at least got to triple digit score, but not even close to rifleman,...YET! Plans are already in the works for next year, if not sooner. Practice and perseverance shall prevail. And Grin let me know when you post the pictures so I can swipe them. Thanks
smle

[Redleg13a]

Please, after you teach 'em to shoot, teach to read a map and use a compass.  Some day a bunch of cold, wet and tired enlisted men you've never met will silently give thanks when they find out their new butterbar isn't getting them lost after all - and you will be responsible.

If there's anything they know when they leave here, it is leadership and land nav.  Our cadets to very well on land nav whether it's at brigade functions or Warrior Forge. 

[bulldog]

I would just like to echo some comments I have already read on the forum.

First off, thank you to Jason, K.R., and Guy,S.O.M., Grin, and also to Rueben, Dan,Wrong Way,Scooter, and all the other guys who gave a hand.

This was the most informative and constructive shoot I have ever been to. I cannot say enough about how much I learned, I mean Hawkeye, Cyclops, Kane and myself had shot the course (or at least what we thought was the course) several times at home before we came and at every point, I found myself trying to correct my bad habits and shooting skills from what I thought was good, or "ok" to the proper method.  I cannot say enough about natual point of aim.  While I did not make rifleman (sigh) I can say I had a very fun time and I will make rifleman sometime soon.

I believe that the next rwva shoot that I attend I will have my kids with me.
Sometimes when you attend these types of events you whonder about the type of environment your kids will be exposed to. But I can say after being there and watching the way the instructors worked with the kids that were there that no one should have even the smallest reservation about bringing the family along.

The historical lectures and discussions were top notch. You can tell that Guy and Son of Martha are very passionate and actually believe in what they are saying, not just giving some pre-memorized speech.  They sure made me sit up and take notice. 

Our group will be in attendance at the Osage Beach shoot next year and since we were the "expeditionary force" I think we will have many more in tow. As for myself, I hope to see ya'll at an upcomng appleseed!! 

[Grin Reaper]

I have a bunch of pics to get posted for your enjoyment, but I had to add my dos centavos.

This was a great shoot.  They're all good, but this one was outstanding.  The attendees were so receptive to the instruction that it seemed like somebody must surely be paying them to attend.

cmidkiff, you made some good points.  I, too, was surprised and delighted to learn we'd have lunch available.  I had planned on munching down 2-4 MetRx bars instead.  Burgers trump MetRx, BTW.  And give my best wishes to Miss Kimberly -- she has all the makings of an outstanding Rifleman.

Capt. Redleg, again I wanted to thank you for bringing the young men in your charge to this event.  I got the impression that everyone was impressed with them -- I know I was.  And I was serious about you having them watch how you manipulate that trigger.

rangerron, if you are the gentleman that I'm thinking of, you would be carrying around a Rifleman's patch had your rear sight not slipped on you.  By the way, you all should have seen his NPOA star target afterwards -- I couldn't have drawn a better example of how one should look when your NPOA is perfect.  Nice shooting, sir.

The Guy was in full Guy-mode for the 2nd Redcoat target.  It almost made me feel sorry for the Brits, the way he got the crowd fired up about blasting crumpet-munchin' officers from 275 yds. away.
Almost.

longshot, Jason, bulldog, smle, and all the rest -- it was a pleasure, and the pleasure was all mine, in making your acquaintences. -- Grin

[Son of Martha]

Mmmm....Shooting....

Mmmm....Camping...

Mmmmm...Instructing....

Mmmm....Lunch....Err, I mean uhh...BONFIRES!

Cool weather.  Good people.  History.  Guns.  Fellowship.  Young'uns.  Zombies nope, taken care of...(inside joke).

If you didn't come, ya missed something.  Hope you get another opportunity...nothing is guaranteed.

Father-child pairs (or triplets!).  Husband-wife.  Bud and buddies, across an age range from 20 to 70-ish.  Cadets.

Americans.  Friends and neighbors.  The guy down the street.

Boot Camp grads.  IITs now, on the Trail.  Friends you didn't even know you had.

A Guy with a time machine...

And a bunch of poor slobs who weren't there, stuck on some golf course thinking they were having fun...

Shoot.  Recruit.  Educate.  Communicate.

Appleseed.

SoM

[Grin Reaper]

TheGuy giving the Welcome to Appleseed talk.

TheGuy & Ruben cover standing.
TheGuy covers how Ball & Dummy works.
Ball & Dummy.
More Ball & Dummy.

more to come...

[Grin Reaper]

You'll need to register to read it, but there's a very complimentary AAR here: http://www.missouricarry.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=17388

"More pics", you say?  OK.


So that's how you make a 2-round Garand clip.


The Missouri Boot Camp grads.



Firing line photos never get old.




Miss Kimberly offhand.

Kneeling is a viable option for Stage 2.
The leather sling has a higher Cool-Factor; it should be obvious to all.

Son of Martha gives his RevWar talk  'in the round.'

How can we fit this much class into one photo?

Could a COOK do this? That's 3 on each redcoat and one perforated officer!

[Longshot]

  I miss THE GUY...      My buddy claims it's his "steely blue gaze", but I feel like I have a new brother (in arms) and it's gonna be a while before we're standin' at the same fire again.

  To everyone who attended, THANK YOU!!   I can't speak for Jason, but I probably lost a couple of years off my life getting this done, and you all made it worthwhile.

Guy, S.O.M. and Grin; You MEN bring new meaning to the term 'patriot'. Never in my life have I found so much respect for people I knew so briefly. But, dammit, did you have to set the hook so deep,,,,?

Dan, Pat, Ruben, Scott, and Wrongway, may your bore always be clean and your ammo always go bang.
We actually have three ranges, and you guys are ALWAYS welcome.

  To all of the other great people and soon-to-be-riflemen, remember what you were taught. Keep shooting, keep practicing, and keep perservering.
But more than that,

Make a difference.

Everyday.





Remeber when we were taught HOW to think, and not WHAT to think?

Longshot

[Madman]

Wow!! I knew I was going to have fun this last weekend, but I had NO IDEA how MUCH fun!
Fun aside, this was a most educational weekend, and truly an inspiring weekend. I have committed to doing dryfire practice EVERY day until I can shoot Rifleman. I'd like to make it to Evansville, but it's looking sketchy. But, I WILL be back to another Appleseed just as soon as I can possibly make it!!

Guy, Grin and SoM, your passion is truly inspirational, and I thank you from the bottom of my heart for your selfless efforts and your dedication.

In the interests of not re-writing my initial thoughts about Appleseed, I'm going to cross post a portion of what I wrote on my "home forum", missouricarry.com.

The history lessons alone were well worth the price of admission. It puts things in perspective when you hear about a colonial militiaman who endured having his leg amputated at the knee, then at the thigh when gangrene set in, and then again at the hip when gangrene set in again, and who finally died when gangrene set in again. It puts things in perspective when you hear about the 70+ year old colonial militiaman who endured a .65 caliber musketball to the face, and being stabbed 13 times with a 16 inch bayonet, only to die an old man at home at the age of 90+. It puts things in perspective to hear about the colonial Rifleman known only to the redcoats as "Death" (with a capital "D") who was clearly one of our first snipers ever, who would consistently stay outside the Brits' musket range, and pick them off one by one. It puts things in perspective when you hear that Paul Revere and several other "riders" were able to summon over fourteen *thousand* militiamen who were mobilized and on the road in six hours or less. It puts things in perspective when you realize that the Minutemen (comprised of the best 1/3 marksmen of all the colonial militiamen) rolled out of bed at 3am and marched 14 miles in the dead of night to fight the redcoats. You realize how much our forefathers sacrificed to birth our nation, how much it meant to them, how dear a price they paid. And then you feel shame at how our fellow citizens have disgraced their memory, soiled their legacy, Sh*te on their posterity, and it makes you *angry*. Then that anger *motivates* you to do something. To practice "firing by the numbers", to drill until you can fire a Rifleman score on the AQT. To attend a bootcamp, to become qualified to instruct other likeminded citizen-soldiers, to teach them to excel with their modern version of a flintlock rifle. To become even more active politically, to engage the enemy in our "soft war", to do everything possible to fight the good fight NOW, to do EVERYTHING we can to ensure we NEVER need to look over our front sight at another mother's son as we squeeze the trigger and feel the recoil, and so that if and when the day comes that we MUST do so, we can say with a clear conscience "I did EVERYTHING I could to avoid this day, to prevent this from happening". (My apologies to The Guy, Grin Reaper and Son of Martha for quoting each of you so liberally - I hope you don't mind, as it's for a good cause!)

I met fellow patriots, young and old alike, who share my passion for Liberty, and the Appleseed vision for saving our country, one Rifleman at a time. I met seasoned shooters, and relative novices (myself among them), who are inspired to better their skills with a rifle. I met truly, incredibly dedicated volunteer instructors, who have spent literally weeks and weeks away from home and their families, without pay, spending their own personal money, to instruct us. They have a PASSION, that were it bottled would be a most potent remedy for our ailing Republic. I met people who would gladly give you the shirt off their back if you were in need. I met people who are the salt of the earth. I met people who have forgotten more about the history of our country than I have ever learned.

I am truly, truly, truly inspired, both to work tirelessly to improve my marksmanship until I can consistently score Rifleman, and to fighting the good fight in the soft war we are currently engaged in. Today I spent 20 minutes working on my prone position and dry firing, sent a personal, handwritten letter to Fred with my feedback about Appleseed, attempted to recruit a coworker for the next Appleseed, recruited my brother to attend the next Appleseed he is able to, shared the Gospel according to Fred with my father, mother, sister, and other brother, worked on plans to bring an Appleseed to western Missouri, and spoke with another forum member who attended Appleseed about getting in some range time with another forum member who is a former rifle competitor, who can help hone and refine our skills. Tomorrow will be even better.  I AM ON FIRE FOR THE CAUSE OF LIBERTY!!! COME, BE ON FIRE WITH ME!!!
What are YOU going to do TODAY for our Nation?

[The Guy]

Quick....



SIGN THAT MAN UP!


Thanks for the kind words.

Feel free to spread the gospel in your travels, and quote what you want from me.



It isn't what they (and you) say here that counts though.  It's what they (and you again) say elsewhere.

So thanks for the copy from MOCarry.  And thanks for doing a knockup good job of it as well.



Appleseed is going to explode on to the scene next year.

We need all the help we can get, so we can reach out to all those who have never heard the word, who have no idea of who Issac Davis was, who are still sleepwalking.

Who can wake up and have the same story as Madman.  "I understand, and I am trying to become a part of it."

Seventh step folks.

Attempting to change the course one person at a time.

Job 1 done here.  Job 2, of course, will be to get this man (and all you others) into a RedHat.

So you can become Dedicated.

To Freedom.



You don't have to travel all over.  Although it is fun.

You don't have to Instruct every weekend.  Though you will wish you could.

There are plenty of things to do in your own region.  And you can get started at the very next Appleseed there.



Madman, you can get started in Evansville.

Would it help if I said I was going to be there too?

I hope to see you there.



To all.  Get out, get active, get into the mindset of winning this Soft War that we are engaged in.

Shoot, Recruit, Communicate, Educate.

For Posterity.

Guy

Next up, Evansville IN, Davilla TX.

[TwoGlock]

Well, I'm probably the only RWVA Instructor that's still an active member of the military. Not active duty, just Army Guard, but a drilling member.

And we thank you for it!

[TwoGlock]

You'll need to register to read it, but there's a very complimentary AAR here: http://www.missouricarry.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=17388

"More pics", you say?  OK.

Thanks for the pictures and the MO Carry link.

[Nickle]

Well, I'm probably the only RWVA Instructor that's still an active member of the military. Not active duty, just Army Guard, but a drilling member.

And we thank you for it!

That kind of thanks makes it worth it all.

[cyclops]

Just like to drop a line telling thanks for the good time to all the instructors.They really show a lot of compassion to come out and volunteer their free time for a cause they believe in.Son of Martha and Guy really know how to make you think that we need to get off the couch and learn to shoot and not rely on protection from someone else.We owe it to those who laid their life on the line to protect our freedom.thanx to all the instructors in training they really stepped up and showed great merit in the cause.                                                         Shoot straight,    Cyclops

[Longshot]

 

  Don't forget;
 
  The 2008 Osage Beach Boot Camp and Appleseed will be held Oct. 19-26 at the same location.


Longshot

[smle]

Making plans now for that weekend, maybe the bootcamp too. smle

[Madman]

 

  Don't forget;
 
  The 2008 Osage Beach Boot Camp and Appleseed will be held Oct. 19-26 at the same location.


Longshot

Ooorah! It was "on" my calendar before I even left the firing line on Sunday!! Plan to see you all there, come hell or high water, good Lord willin' and the crick don't rise. Course I hope to see some familiar faces at some Appleseeds in other states well before October of next year!