Author Topic: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area  (Read 4623 times)

Offline The Machine

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2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« on: October 22, 2009, 01:49:31 AM »
OK folks, 2010 is right around the corner and we need to get everyone on board expanding our WV program next year. Specifically, we need to be diligently working on the following right now:

1. I need event locations firmed-up pronto! There's been a lot of talk about "possibly, maybe, pretty sure, etc.", but I need to start hearing "come to location 'xyz' and do a site inspection and get the host application filled out". I would like to see 3-4 locations just for our next 'Patriot's Day' shoots. We can't wait until next March to start looking for host sites...we need to schedule them now. I'm setting a target--no pun intended--of at least 50 ASs in WV next year, covering all parts of the state. That means we need at least 4 more locations, besides Stinson.

2. We will need more instructors to staff all these additional shoots in 2010. How the heck do we do that? Well, for starters, we need to get those who are already IITs up to Red Hat status ASAP. You folks are the foundation from which our IC will continue to grow. Secondly, we need to start bumping the attendance at our ASs. It will only be from running enough people through our shoots, that new instructors will emerge. Spanner is our WV IC Coordinator, so communicate with him regularly about getting signed-up for shoots, doing PCs, etc.

3. Promotions...this is probably the most "hammered" topic on this WV board, thus far. If number of words and posts could translate to more bodies on the firing line, we'd be leaps-and-bounds ahead of where we are now. Mountaineer just started a new WV AS blog; let's start directing some traffic to it. I'm still looking for that elusive 'Promotions Coordinator', with no luck so far. Again, word-of-mouth works best. That's why I want someone to get a schedule of gun shows and other public venues that we can be working. We can appoint small, regional, 3-man teams to run these venues.

4. My ultimate goal is to be hosting ASs in every county within WV by the end of 2012. 2010 will be a spring-board to make that happen. This goal will be mentioned frequently, just so it develops some mental imagery of what we are working towards.  ;)

I know all of you have ideas to contribute, so let's use this area exclusively to flesh-out a workable plan for 2010. I look forward to your comments...
"I proudly support limited government and unlimited common sense"

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Offline Mountaineer

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2009, 10:24:11 AM »
I'm working with a contact at Mason-Dixon Gun Club on hosting AS's.  Will update as I know more...

In Liberty,
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"History has shown us that government leaders often ignore the fundamental fact that people demand both dignity and freedom. Stripping motivated people of their dignity and rubbing their noses in it is a very bad idea."

Offline Chrome

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2010, 05:55:53 PM »
I'm working with a contact at Mason-Dixon Gun Club on hosting AS's.  Will update as I know more...



I'm very anxiously awaiting this to go through!

Later,
Chrome...
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Offline The Machine

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2010, 06:24:28 PM »
I'm working with a contact at Mason-Dixon Gun Club on hosting AS's.  Will update as I know more...



I'm very anxiously awaiting this to go through!

Later,
Chrome...
Welcome aboard Chrome!  O0

You will soon catch the drift of how things work around here..."it won't happen unless you make it happen". I'm sure it wouldn't break Mountaineer's heart if you offered to lend a hand on infiltrating the Mason-Dixon Gun Club.  ;) We have found through experience that 2-3 man/woman teams are more effective at moving our WV AS program forward, rather than a solo performance. I encourage you to look over our WV jobs list and see if something interests you: http://appleseedinfo.org/smf/index.php?topic=5594.0 . There's plenty of unfilled slots and I hear the pay is excellent! I look forward to meeting you at one of our upcoming shoots in the near future.
"I proudly support limited government and unlimited common sense"

"One of the great advantages of the American Revolution has been, that it led to a discovery of the principles, and laid open the imposition, of governments." - Thomas Paine 1792

"It does not take many words to speak the truth"

Offline Mountaineer

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #4 on: February 22, 2010, 02:00:17 AM »
Update on Mason-Dixon.

As of now, it looks like it's a no-go.  Apparently they are very, very .... let's say picky, about the events that they host.  I will keep politely pushing it, but as of now, it don't look to good.
In Liberty,
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"History has shown us that government leaders often ignore the fundamental fact that people demand both dignity and freedom. Stripping motivated people of their dignity and rubbing their noses in it is a very bad idea."

Offline Chrome

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #5 on: February 22, 2010, 07:57:19 PM »
Time to start on these guys then.  Just came across them today.

http://mysite.verizon.net/vze52nyj/wvsfa/index.html

Later,
Chrome...
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Offline The Machine

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #6 on: February 22, 2010, 10:28:12 PM »
Quote
Apparently they are very, very .... let's say picky, about the events that they host.
What that tells me, is apparently they set their bar low in regards to events. A quality program such as AS is off the table? Shame on them! Nice try anyhow Kev, maybe they'll see the light before it's too late.

Good suggestion on that other location Chrome, it's in an area that we need to infiltrate. We really have nothing going on up north at this time.

Speaking of nothing going on...we have our first shoot coming up at Stinson on March 20th, and 2 locations for Patriot's Day weekend, but there's no instructors signed up for these shoots besides Spanner. Also, I'm not aware of any promotional efforts going on for any of our events this year. I can't go it alone folks, especially now that I'm in recovery mode from this recent illness, so can I hear from anyone that is doing anything in regards to either instructing and/or promoting? Preferably, you should post what you are working on in this thread, so we can all be on the same page.

As soon as the weather breaks and we all aren't dealing with this never-ending snow, a trip to Beckley will need to be done ASAP. I know some of you have already expressed interest in participating on a work crew for this location, so hold tight, your services will be called upon very soon. You can work on promotions in your local area in the mean time.  ;)
"I proudly support limited government and unlimited common sense"

"One of the great advantages of the American Revolution has been, that it led to a discovery of the principles, and laid open the imposition, of governments." - Thomas Paine 1792

"It does not take many words to speak the truth"

Offline Mountaineer

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2010, 12:24:51 PM »
Yesterday I sent a request to work the Mar 20-21 AS in Stinson.  I don't know if it's up yet.  I'll send another in a week if i don't see it.  I updated the WV AS Blog: http://wvappleseed.blogspot.com/

So the registration links and such are now correct for the next AS.  I'll be bringing my fiancee to the Mar 20-21 AS, and it looks like she's going to shoot, too.  I'm trying to get my younger brother on board, but he's got so many extracurricular activities going on, it's hard to find a whole weekend free!

I'm probably going to be buying a table at the next Morgantown Gun Show (Mar 27-28) for my run for House, and I can set out some AS info too, if that's not a problem.

---Mountaineer
In Liberty,
--- Mountaineer
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"History has shown us that government leaders often ignore the fundamental fact that people demand both dignity and freedom. Stripping motivated people of their dignity and rubbing their noses in it is a very bad idea."

Offline The Machine

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #8 on: February 24, 2010, 06:53:33 PM »
Quote
Yesterday I sent a request to work the Mar 20-21 AS in Stinson.  I don't know if it's up yet.  I'll send another in a week if i don't see it.  I updated the WV AS Blog: http://wvappleseed.blogspot.com/
Great, on both counts. It appears we have 3 instructors signed on for the March shoot (Spanner-SB, Mountaineer, siglite) but where are you other IITs that need a PC done?

Quote
I'll be bringing my fiancee to the Mar 20-21 AS, and it looks like she's going to shoot, too.  I'm trying to get my younger brother on board, but he's got so many extracurricular activities going on, it's hard to find a whole weekend free!
I'm looking forward to meeting Mina...do you want me to reserve the "Love Nest" in the Instructor's Clubhouse for you two lovebirds?  ;D  As for that "younger" brother, I know your "elder" status and power of persuasion will steer him to the firing line.  ;)

Quote
I'm probably going to be buying a table at the next Morgantown Gun Show (Mar 27-28) for my run for House, and I can set out some AS info too, if that's not a problem.
Any wise candidate should be a supporter of AS--no problem. I'll even loan you a banner and give you a stack of promo material if you'd like.



« Last Edit: February 27, 2010, 12:07:21 PM by The Machine »
"I proudly support limited government and unlimited common sense"

"One of the great advantages of the American Revolution has been, that it led to a discovery of the principles, and laid open the imposition, of governments." - Thomas Paine 1792

"It does not take many words to speak the truth"

Offline The Machine

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2010, 04:35:06 PM »
Another location that siglite spearheaded negotiations with last year, Putnam County Gun Club, is on the table for hosting AS events this summer. Siglite is in the process of setting up a July shoot. I'm passing this info along so any instructors wanting to work this location can plan accordingly.

I did a walk-through of this facility last year and was very impressed with the amenities and range possibilities. You can get a feel for the location from their website: http://www.putnamcountygunclub.org/ .

They are heavily affiliated with the NRA and have a very active schedule of sanctioned shoots throughout the year. We are trying to squeeze whatever AS events we can into their schedule this year with the intention that they will not feel intimidated by our program. The "intimidation factor" was the biggest hurdle that siglite had to deal with, but he addressed it well at a Board meeting that he attended.

A lot of clubs in WV are affiliated with and supported by the NRA, so making a good impression at PCGC and developing a close rapport with their membership, will hopefully open some more doors for us in the near future at these other ranges. That's the plan, anyhow.  ;)

As soon as a date is firmed up, I'll pass the info along.
"I proudly support limited government and unlimited common sense"

"One of the great advantages of the American Revolution has been, that it led to a discovery of the principles, and laid open the imposition, of governments." - Thomas Paine 1792

"It does not take many words to speak the truth"

Offline Old Dog

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #10 on: February 27, 2010, 07:02:32 PM »
I could be wrong but it seems to me by spreading the Appleseeds around the state you'll expose more people to it and therefore more possible new instructors and support folks.  Maybe even draw some folks from "just across the line" to when you get closer to eastern Kentucky and Tennesee.

Offline The Machine

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #11 on: February 27, 2010, 09:00:55 PM »
I could be wrong but it seems to me by spreading the Appleseeds around the state you'll expose more people to it and therefore more possible new instructors and support folks.  Maybe even draw some folks from "just across the line" to when you get closer to eastern Kentucky and Tennesee.
You're not wrong OD, you see, that's exactly what's unfolding...our "master plan".  :cool2: 

We are in the phase of sectioning the state into regions, with a representative "host" for each region. The guys/gals up north are just lagging behind the southern volunteers at this time. Currently we have the south and central regions covered pretty well; I think things will start shaking loose shortly in the northern tier.

The original goal of our WV program still stands; an AS in every county by the end of 2012. Of course, all of this is directly proportional to the motivation of our WV volunteers.  ;)

I hope you can make it across the border again this year to lend a hand with one of these events.
"I proudly support limited government and unlimited common sense"

"One of the great advantages of the American Revolution has been, that it led to a discovery of the principles, and laid open the imposition, of governments." - Thomas Paine 1792

"It does not take many words to speak the truth"

Offline The Machine

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #12 on: May 02, 2010, 10:56:03 PM »
Time to start on these guys then.  Just came across them today.

http://mysite.verizon.net/vze52nyj/wvsfa/index.html

Later,
Chrome...
It's been awhile...any headway on this location Chrome? Could you please give us an update? We need to really start ramping things up in the northern part of the state! We're in the 2nd year of the program here, and we have not one location, nor held a shoot north of Stinson. Can someone please explain this?
"I proudly support limited government and unlimited common sense"

"One of the great advantages of the American Revolution has been, that it led to a discovery of the principles, and laid open the imposition, of governments." - Thomas Paine 1792

"It does not take many words to speak the truth"

Offline The Machine

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #13 on: May 03, 2010, 12:09:26 AM »
Quote
Another location that siglite spearheaded negotiations with last year, Putnam County Gun Club, is on the table for hosting AS events this summer. Siglite is in the process of setting up a July shoot. I'm passing this info along so any instructors wanting to work this location can plan accordingly.
Can I also get an update on this please? If we are going to get on the schedule for July or Aug. I need a date(s) ASAP. The gals who deal with scheduling request a 60 day lead time.
"I proudly support limited government and unlimited common sense"

"One of the great advantages of the American Revolution has been, that it led to a discovery of the principles, and laid open the imposition, of governments." - Thomas Paine 1792

"It does not take many words to speak the truth"

Offline Spanner

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #14 on: May 03, 2010, 12:10:22 AM »

We're in the 2nd year of the program here, and we have not one location, nor held a shoot north of Stinson. Can someone please explain this?
 

The entire western half of PA is north of Stinson.   :D

It contains locations, and good ones at that.
 
Timing is everything.   :wb:
 
Spacing is a close second.   #)
 
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Offline The Machine

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #15 on: May 03, 2010, 02:04:48 AM »

We're in the 2nd year of the program here, and we have not one location, nor held a shoot north of Stinson. Can someone please explain this?
 

The entire western half of PA is north of Stinson.   :D

It contains locations, and good ones at that.
 
Timing is everything.   :wb:
 
Spacing is a close second.   #)
 

I need to make something very clear so everyone in WV understands the situation perfectly. As State Coordinator of WV, I'm only concerned with program development and expansion in our home state, first and foremost. This is the prioritization of every State Coordinator, or at least that's what's expected of them. The ranges, instructor staffing, turnouts, promo efforts, etc. of other states are not of my concern, other than to learn what they may be doing successfully that we aren't. If and when we are in a position to lend out our WV instructors, or provide other assistance which doesn't conflict with our state agenda, then we will gladly do so.

While we are a nationwide program with full intentions of saturating the entire country, we do this by developing each state to it's fullest potential, using available in-state resources. If a surrounding state needs a hand getting on their feet, and an established neighboring state has staff to lend, that's wonderful. Like I alluded to in the recently sent PM, there's currently a demand for each state to start setting up new locations, while continuing to build it's Instructor Corps rapidly. This has really always been the case, but there's been a resurgence in stressing this from the national "administrative" side. Fred's tasked every State Coordinator with running an average of 20,000 people through their respective state AS programs yearly, by 2016. I've said it since last year that I want every county in WV hosting ASs by the end of 2012. Now the question is how are we going to accomplish this? I can tell you it won't happen by us worrying what's going on in other states.  ;)

Why is there a huge sold out shoot coming up in New Philadelphia, OH? Why are upcoming shoots in MD sold out? And most importantly; why aren't we having similar results in WV? I'll tell you why...there's people in those states--LBOTG--working constantly on promotions and steering people to those locations. Someone in VA invited a Washington Post reporter to their Buckingham Patriot's Day shoot; now MD is selling out. Siglite is getting WSAZ TV to cover one of our shoots in the near future. Siglite has done a lot for the southern part of our state, and I'm thankful. Spanner has taken the heat off of me from having to import outside Shoot Bosses, and I'm thankful. The truth is, there's more than the 3 of us in this program, and I'd really appreciate some help from the rest of you. To meet the goal of maximizing WV's potential, we MUST all be working diligently together as a team. I'm not picking on anyone, or singling anyone out; it just has to be this way (team effort)--period.

I've said this several times before, but I'll repeat it again, EVERYONE is a promoter for WV shoots, and EVERYONE is a location scout. It doesn't matter if your main desire is to instruct, or whatever, we all need to be walking, talking, billboards to promote and find new locations to expand the program in WV. Every individual we encounter on a daily basis is a prospective "sleeping American" who needs to attend a WV AS. Every store or business that we enter is a prospective location to post, hand out, or leave literature at.

We can do, or not do, anything we put our mind, energy, and time into. We're all volunteers, and no one can force anyone to do anything in this program...that's a given. I personally don't do this as a hobby, social opportunity, or to feed my ego. I do this because I respect and honor what was done by those who came before us, to give us an advantage which they didn't initially have; a representative government of, by, and for the sovereign people. My fight is against the laziness, ignorance, and apathy of the sleeping masses.

I've tried to restate the general Mission statement of our WV AS program once again. The immediate goal of AS in WV is to get into every county by the end of 2012...it can happen! If it's still not clear and anyone would like further explanation, please add a post or send me a PM. I would also appreciate some constructive answers to the 2 questions I asked about the locations in the previous posts above. Thanks!  :)

[After a private discussion, I felt a need to clarify and enter this addendum to this section. I'm not a "slave driver" and don't expect everyone to be doing everything. Some are better talkers, others are more apprehensive approaching strangers. I'm not asking everyone to find a location, attend a Board meeting, do a site evaluation, and finalize the paperwork. If someone spots a location that looks promising and they don't want to go beyond that, send a PM to me or one of the other folks who could handle it. Same applies to promotions, if you see an opportunity and don't feel you can handle it yourself, at least make a post about it and hopefully someone else will pick it up. Everyone, even the most timid unskilled people I've known, can post a state flyer on a bulletin board, or set some out somewhere. Posting shoot dates on a community calendar, or making comments on internet forums and blogs, should be within the skill sets of anyone who has access to a computer. For the more adventurous, sending emails to certain target groups in WV is another possibility. There's even letter templates available that I'll put in the promo download area. The general point is that we have a decent size group of volunteers in WV now; all the work shouldn't have to be deferred onto 2-3 people. Many people doing a little, is far better than a couple people doing a lot.  :)]
« Last Edit: May 07, 2010, 12:39:43 AM by The Machine »
"I proudly support limited government and unlimited common sense"

"One of the great advantages of the American Revolution has been, that it led to a discovery of the principles, and laid open the imposition, of governments." - Thomas Paine 1792

"It does not take many words to speak the truth"

Offline vanrichten

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #16 on: May 03, 2010, 09:17:59 AM »
I think there are a few issues at play in WV as far as numbers and shoot locations.

1) Everyone already thinks they can shoot and getting someone to spend money to come "learn to shoot" when they already know how is not going to happen easily.  Most of the people that I talk to have no idea what MOA or NPOA even is.  Those that do, feel they already know it well enough so why come out?  That is the number 1 reason I have been given when I get shot down.  I have had 1 person attend a shoot that I have invited, out of probably 100 that I have personally given flyers and information to.  They level of apathy is astounding and is very difficult to overcome.  I invite everyone I know, even remotely, to the Appleseed.  It is a tough nut to crack, but we are making in-roads. 

2) People that are interested in shooting either already have their own "range" at home or go to a range like KSF, PCGC or BGC and see no need to travel somewhere else to shoot. 

3) The connotation.  The number 1 question I have been asked about the Appleseed is "are you recruiting people for a militia or something?"  We all know that is bupkus but convincing outsiders of that is very difficult.  If we can get someone from WSAZ out I think that would help a lot.  I would love to have an article in the paper, but getting something pro-gun in the Gazette is next to impossible.

We ARE growing.  It seems slow but it is happening.  BGC loved us and wants us back.  They have already said they would host a RBC down there.  PCGC seems to be on board and I know we will have one there soon.  I am in the process of joining the FOP range just outside of South Charleston, I have toured the facilities and I think we could very easily run one there if they get on board.  I just have to go through the process of joining so I can have a voice at the meetings.

We have gotten 4 new IIT's so far this year.  If we can get an IBC, which I would attend, set up we will get some more SB's soon.  To me, that is honestly our number 1 limiting factor right now.  We will fix that and move forward from there. 
An armed and informed law-abiding citizenry is the best defense against an unjust government and the criminal element created by irresponsible societal benevolence and activist judges. - Lt. Col. Allen West

Offline The Machine

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #17 on: May 03, 2010, 12:41:36 PM »
Vanrichten, the responses you are getting are very typical and common of the WV "prospects" we encounter. What I usually do now is ask people "Do you know what happened on April 19, 1775?"; the vast majority have no clue. Then I explain to them if they attend an AS, they will never forget the significance of that date. Also, I explain to them that they won't get an appreciation of April 19, 1775 or our foundational heritage by shooting in their back yard, or with buddies at a range. If they insist that they know everything that we teach about rifle marksmanship, great!...tell 'em we are always looking for more instructors...why keep all those "skills" to themselves?  ;)

Militia? ;D As soon as that word was mentioned, I'd politely shove a reprint of the Ft. Stewart flyer into their hand and say "Yeah, the US Army is requesting militia instructors now to instruct their troops before deployment". I love to watch the blank look on their face!  :o

West Virginians are no different than the typical "sleeping American" when it comes to excuses; perhaps it's more perfected in these parts. Snapping one out of their status quo mindset of ignorance, apathy, and laziness is a real challenge, but we can get creative as we go about it too...place them in a mental "corner" where the excuses run out. In doing so, perhaps for the first time in their life, they will look in the mirror and see an image they never reflected upon. They still might not come to an AS--immediately--but we got their mental wheels moving in a direction opposite of the norm. Isn't that a part of AS? We don't tell people what to think; we just want them to start thinking! With practice, we can all be good at doing this. :)

Thanks for your thoughts on the other items you mentioned. I know you have been trying, and that's all I ask from anyone...put forth your best effort.  O0

 
"I proudly support limited government and unlimited common sense"

"One of the great advantages of the American Revolution has been, that it led to a discovery of the principles, and laid open the imposition, of governments." - Thomas Paine 1792

"It does not take many words to speak the truth"

Offline vanrichten

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #18 on: May 03, 2010, 12:59:25 PM »
I need to get some of the flyers about the Ft. Stewart shoot.  I have the reprint from the SWAT article that I give them for now.  I also want to get some of the targets to make up a packet of stuff to give out.  

ETA - I got the White Sands and the Ft Stewart stuff and printed 100 of each, also got the Saving America and the 15 yard target.  Making up some packets this evening to start handing out  ..:..

Most of the people that I have tried to mention the history aspect too have seemed un-interested in the extreme.  Seems like most of the people that I know are happy being dumb  >:(

As for the put up or shut up, that works sometimes.  Most of the time I get accused of being condescending  !@#)

We will crack this nut.  The WSAZ spot should help a lot if we can get that set up.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2010, 01:37:33 PM by vanrichten »
An armed and informed law-abiding citizenry is the best defense against an unjust government and the criminal element created by irresponsible societal benevolence and activist judges. - Lt. Col. Allen West

Offline The Machine

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #19 on: May 03, 2010, 01:36:40 PM »
We don't need to come across as "condescending", if we do things in a polite and tactful manner. It might take a little practice, but over time, it'll come naturally.  :)

We don't have a glossy reprint for Ft. Stewart at the present time, as far as I know. You can download and print copies out from our WV "Promo Downloads" area: http://appleseedinfo.org/smf/index.php?topic=12638.msg104358#msg104358


"I proudly support limited government and unlimited common sense"

"One of the great advantages of the American Revolution has been, that it led to a discovery of the principles, and laid open the imposition, of governments." - Thomas Paine 1792

"It does not take many words to speak the truth"

Offline vanrichten

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #20 on: May 03, 2010, 01:38:38 PM »
Yep, just found them and edited my post above :)  Perfect timing.

Asking people to put up or shut up is evidently condescending.  Who knew?  %)
An armed and informed law-abiding citizenry is the best defense against an unjust government and the criminal element created by irresponsible societal benevolence and activist judges. - Lt. Col. Allen West

Offline Spanner

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #21 on: May 03, 2010, 03:11:35 PM »

Guys, hang in there.  WV is not like the rest of the country.  Appleseed is not going to follow the pattern here that it follows in other parts of the country.  Progress and milestones can't be measured the same way, or, rather, shouldn't be.
 
What is being done is working.  Let's not get all hysterical.  We are not desperadoes. 
 
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Offline siglite

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #22 on: May 03, 2010, 03:42:38 PM »

Guys, hang in there.  WV is not like the rest of the country.  Appleseed is not going to follow the pattern here that it follows in other parts of the country.  Progress and milestones can't be measured the same way, or, rather, shouldn't be.
 
What is being done is working.  Let's not get all hysterical.  We are not desperadoes. 
 


Aw gee thanks, Spanner.  Now I have that friggin Eagles tune stuck in my head.   :wb:
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Offline Spanner

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #23 on: May 03, 2010, 03:45:17 PM »
Now I have that friggin Eagles tune stuck in my head.   :wb:

Sorry, but that's "Life in the Vaseline".   **)
 
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Offline vanrichten

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #24 on: May 03, 2010, 03:50:12 PM »

Guys, hang in there.  WV is not like the rest of the country.  Appleseed is not going to follow the pattern here that it follows in other parts of the country.  Progress and milestones can't be measured the same way, or, rather, shouldn't be.
 
What is being done is working.  Let's not get all hysterical.  We are not desperadoes. 
 


Aw gee thanks, Spanner.  Now I have that friggin Eagles tune stuck in my head.   :wb:

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Offline Chrome

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #25 on: May 03, 2010, 05:49:49 PM »
Forgot to mention my glimmer of hope last week.  While I was at the Pedlar Wildlife Range, I looked down and found a well used RWVA chamber flag.  All of mine were accounted for, so unless Spanner of Mountaineer had been there, at least someone else in the area has been.

As far as the update on the Fairmont range, I've dispatched an email asking to tour the facility (since I've never been there) and inquiring about membership dues, etc.  I have not heard back yet, but it's been less than a week.

Later,
Chrome...
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Offline The Machine

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #26 on: May 03, 2010, 07:35:11 PM »
Thanks for the update Chrome...I hope it pans out.

Hysterical? I don't consider putting forth what our goal is, and what we should be focusing on, as being "hysterical". Aside from our demographic differences in WV, gauging success and the means to become successful aren't any different from other states...it follows the tried and true method of consistent work and dedication, from everyone. As long as we are on the same page, and everyone puts their best effort into what they are supposed to be doing, is that a recipe for failure? I believe a positive outcome will be achieved in any state where this is "tested".

I'm also not implying that things are going miserably in WV. To the contrary, a lot of positive stuff is occurring lately. Have we maximized our potential? Not even close. Do we currently have enough resources to improve things dramatically in the near term...3-4 months? I know we do. I don't want any of us to get stuck in the rut of "static" thinking, when it applies to possibilities for program growth here. That's the main gist of this entire thread...planning, growing, keeping things in motion.

I'll tell you when things will become hysterical for me. If the day comes where AS fails it's Mission, largely due to a lack of effort by the greater whole, then I will probably be a very unpleasant individual to be around. I believe this program has been a gift of opportunity thrown in our laps; perhaps even our last peaceful hope of righting the wrongs in our nation. Wouldn't any sane person get hysterical to see that wasted?

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Offline Spanner

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #27 on: May 04, 2010, 02:42:46 PM »

I need to make something very clear so everyone in WV understands the situation perfectly. As State Coordinator of WV, I'm only concerned with program development and expansion in our home state, first and foremost. This is the prioritization of every State Coordinator, or at least that's what's expected of them. The ranges, instructor staffing, turnouts, promo efforts, etc. of other states are not of my concern, other than to learn what they may be doing successfully that we aren't. If and when we are in a position to lend out our WV instructors, or provide other assistance which doesn't conflict with our state agenda, then we will gladly do so.

While we are a nationwide program with full intentions of saturating the entire country, we do this by developing each state to it's fullest potential, using available in-state resources. If a surrounding state needs a hand getting on their feet, and an established neighboring state has staff to lend, that's wonderful. Like I alluded to in the recently sent PM, there's currently a demand for each state to start setting up new locations, while continuing to build it's Instructor Corps rapidly. This has really always been the case, but there's been a resurgence in stressing this from the national "administrative" side. Fred's tasked every State Coordinator with running an average of 20,000 people through their respective state AS programs yearly, by 2016. I've said it since last year that I want every county in WV hosting ASs by the end of 2012. Now the question is how are we going to accomplish this? I can tell you it won't happen by us worrying what's going on in other states.  ;)


Where are these policies (suggestions? strategies?) stated and sanctioned at the national level?  A link would be appreciated.
 
Are instructors the property of their state or SC?  When did we (instructors) agree to (ratify) the above?
 
I thought we were volunteers, with an appreciation of the power of division of labor, and the ability to choose within reason how best to apply our time and effort.
 
If we were a coal mining company, would it make sense to ask Florida to have a coal mine in every county?  Asking them to send coal miners to where the coal is deposited makes more sense to me.
 
Take a look at the first sentence of the second quoted paragraph.  I can't tell whether that is a theory or a mandate.  Either way, it begs for discussion.
 
Even fast food restaurant chains don't grow according to that model.  Grass doesn't grow according to that model.  How much effort did J. Appleseed spend on seeding the great salt lake?  Door-to-door salesmen, if they were any good, spent their time in neighborhoods where people were buying. 
 
Yes, everyone should be exposed to Appleseed at some point.  The question is: is the growth of Appleseed best served by location pressure or by instructor-population pressure?  Some of both, but with the mix depending on local circumstances, which of course change with time as the local instructor corp reaches various levels of maturity.  Instructor mobility is important and should be encouraged. 
 
I'm not a big fan of empire builders (been there, done that-- there are better ways); I'd much prefer to be stateless.
 
Perhaps most important of all: don't you get tired of the WV inbreeding jokes? 
 
Just so everyone knows:  The Machine and I discuss stuff like this all the time.  I'm not flaming him at all, and I'm not really saying anything he hasn't heard from me before.  The poor guy is just trying to do his job, and I'm trying to do my part as well.  I just happened to luck out in the "good cop/bad cop" assignments.
 
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Offline The Machine

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #28 on: May 04, 2010, 04:16:47 PM »
Quote
Where are these policies (suggestions? strategies?) stated and sanctioned at the national level?  A link would be appreciated.
Most of the detailed discussion about this is located in the State Coordinator section of the forum, which is only accessible to SCs and upper "administration".

Quote
Are instructors the property of their state or SC?  When did we (instructors) agree to (ratify) the above?
No volunteer at any position is the "property" of another in this program. Common sense dictates much of what is done in AS, not everything is written down on paper. This can be a good, or bad thing, depending on how an individual views it. Most people who have been in the program for awhile have figured out the overarching purpose and protocol of AS, without a lot of explaining needing to be done. There is so much info that can be read on the forum, much of it dating back to 2007, where most questions such as this have been addressed in one form or another.

Quote
Take a look at the first sentence of the second quoted paragraph.  I can't tell whether that is a theory or a mandate.  Either way, it begs for discussion.
AS has gone through quite an evolution since it's beginnings in 2006. Initially, the number of locations hosting events and the instructor resources, were small. There weren't even State Coordinators back then. :o  As current circumstances usually dictate logistics within the program, a lot of instructors had no choice but to travel extensively in those days, to make the program grow. The theme has always been to bring new locations online, along with growing the instructor ranks, so more work could be done at a local level. That was also the impetus behind the creation of State Coordinators.

Quote
I'm not a big fan of empire builders (been there, done that-- there are better ways); I'd much prefer to be stateless.
I think you know where I stand on this topic.  ;)  
While AS is an all-volunteer, grassroots operation, there is a vision and organizational structure behind it. I don't recall "empire building" being part of that vision.

I use the analogy of a sports team sometimes as an example. Basically, there is the team owner, a coaching staff, and players. They have to operate within the rules and guidelines sanction by whatever league they play in. Putting faces to this analogy; Fred would be the "owner" and "head coach; administrative staff on the national and state level would be "coaching staff"; everyone else are the "players"; state and federal governments sanction the "league rules".

Assuming our hypothetical "sports team" is all volunteer, nobody has to enter into any of these positions if they don't want to. For the entire operation to work effectively, those who choose to participate, do so with full intentions of being a "team player" for the benefit of all. The coaches develop the strategies and "plays"; while the "players" are expected to execute the same. Do things always work that way? 

Maybe it's a lousy analogy, but I think it gets the general point across.

I don't want to drag stuff like this out any more than it has to be. Otherwise it develops into a distraction from all the work that we need to be doing. I always appreciate questions and will do my best to answer them.

« Last Edit: May 06, 2010, 11:26:06 PM by The Machine »
"I proudly support limited government and unlimited common sense"

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Offline Ratchett

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Re: 2010 WV AS General Planning Area
« Reply #29 on: May 04, 2010, 04:41:36 PM »
Hi fellow West Virginians!

Just wanted to pass on that we have placed the Athens, Ohio May 22-23 shoot on the community calendar pages of channels 3 & 13. I do not know how much exposure that will get but at least it is a start. It is something you might consider. Also, another news source may be the university news channels--- I am not familiar with what Marshall and WVU have to offer, but OU has a public broadcast station that does evening news and we are working on getting some air time with them.

Just a couple ideas that may or may not help... I am originally from the Clendenin area, was born in Charleston and transplanted to Ohio way long ago $$-0 If any other help I might offer will try

In His Grip,
Ratchett
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