Uncommon and Minority Calibers

[VaWolf]

I do not own a K31 but it is high on my wish list. A friend of mine has one and hit the 20" gong at 200 meters every time from standing. I was impressed. We also looked at the cartridge and figured it is like a 308 with 40 degree Ackley improved shoulder and radiused like a Weatherby. I want one bad but must get the M1A first.  Tommy

[bob 210]

Has anyone tried the 1970's Hirtenberger 6.5x55mm Swede ammo....sportsman's guide is selling it for .48/rnd.

[socalserf]

Has anyone tried the 1970's Hirtenberger 6.5x55mm Swede ammo....sportsman's guide is selling it for .48/rnd.

Don't know if its the same stuff but I got a bunch of '70 manufactured 6.5x55 from J&G for about this price recently. (Hitenberger is an Austrian manufacturer?)
NC Berdan primed ,steel core and some minor green on the cases. It shoots good in my M96. Oh yeah, I believe that Century sells stripper clips for the Swedes at a good price in bulk.

One word I would add about the Swiss K31. The case need to be full length resized and the chambers are generous. So, the case life is short.
Beautiful rifles but, unproven on the field of battle. The Ross rifle does come to mind.
A great curio/target rifle. Seems it should go far down the list as a WTSHTF tool.

[scopeboy001]

has anyone tried the 577 t-rex?  i've seen alot of youtube videos and it looks like a really fun gun to try (once) idk.  anyway if u havent seen the videos i recomend that you check them out they are really funny.

[socalserf]

has anyone tried the 577 t-rex?  i've seen alot of youtube videos and it looks like a really fun gun to try (once) idk.  anyway if u havent seen the videos i recomend that you check them out they are really funny.

Nope, I like my shoulder.

[Professor]

Samco sells military surplus 6.5x55 for $73.80 for 200 rounds and $295.20 for a case of 800 rounds.  Their web site is www.samcoglobal.com.  I had good luck ordering from them many years ago. 

[sxsdoublegun]

Anyone else out there with a M1895 Dutch Mannlicher in 6.5 Dutch?

I understand that .303 Brit cases can be used to make up ammo to feed this little carbine.  Action is smooth as glass.

I have been ordering some ammo from AIM.  Was pleased with the customer service. 


Max

[Nickle]

Anyone else out there with a M1895 Dutch Mannlicher in 6.5 Dutch?

I understand that .303 Brit cases can be used to make up ammo to feed this little carbine.  Action is smooth as glass.

I have been ordering some ammo from AIM.  Was pleased with the customer service. 


Max

You can make them from .303 British, you may need to turn the rim to .526".

You can buy Bertram Brass from Graf's (or other sources, like Midway), but it isn't cheap. One of the few available items that is worth making versus buying already made.

If you're doing a LOT of odd stuff, like my father and I, invest in a copy of "The Handloader's Manual of Cartridge Conversions", by Donnelly. Amazon has it available.

[Spatulaman]

Two big thumbs up on "The Handloader's Manual...." Bought my copy 20-some odd years ago when it first came out, and have never once regretted the purchase price. Hours of fascinating reading, including equipment you need, setting up your reloading operation, and much more.

[davecampperry]

Always remember that the SMLE bolt locks up at the rear, so the casing will stretch with every shot and eventually separate. When I find Boxer .303 brass new, I size it for my 30-40 Krag. I use nothing but milsurp in my SMLEs. A blown case head is never cheap.

[scopeboy001]

i know that i dont buy them too often but, what the hell happened to the price of primers?!!! last i knew they were $20.00 for a brick of 1000  CCI No. 209's
    now all of the sudden it's around 32 bucks!! WTF.
I might as well buy surplus an sacrifice the hightened results of handloading.

[Oohrah]

Yep Scopeboy, had the same sticker shock.  Appears maybe hoarding is
also going on.  Last month I was going to order 5000 each of large and
small rifle primers.  Most were out of stock or per 1000.   Windners had
5000 Wolf brand at 84 to 89 bucks.   Heard a few bad, but mostly OK to
good about them.   Their ammo all goes  bang with mostly good reports.

They recommend if using the small rifle primers for semi auto, to be their
Mag primers.   They are not hotter, but they are harder.   Getting to the
point of what can you afford, gasoline or bullets.

[zercool]

anyone have a line on a odd little cartridge i found loose in my gun case it's a 25-20   looks cool, wanted to know if anyone has info on it?

Nickle already beat me to the single vs. repeater... My father has my great-grandfather's .25-20WCF lever gun, along with a couple partial boxes of unreliable ammo. It was designed to throw an 86-grain soft- or flat-point bullet around 2000fps, if I recall correctly. Remington and Winchester are still producing factory loads, but it's up around $45-50/box of 50. MUCH cheaper to reload if you want to shoot it. Brass is on a seasonal run from Remington and Winchester, can sometimes be found from Midway or Midsouth, and usually can be found in small quantities on Gunbroker. Bullets are easy; you can find the 86gr pills regularly or can cast lead just fine.

The rifle was originally marketed as a deer rifle, but general consensus was/is that it's just a touch too underpowered to reliably handle whitetails. For small predators and pest control out to 100yd or so, it's a great cartridge - coyotes and woodchucks beware!

The rifles themselves are also getting tough to find; they never really competed with the .30-30 in terms of popularity.

[Francis Marion]

...   Windners had
5000 Wolf brand at 84 to 89 bucks.   Heard a few bad, but mostly OK to
good about them.   Their ammo all goes  bang with mostly good reports.

They recommend if using the small rifle primers for semi auto, to be their
Mag primers.   They are not hotter, but they are harder.   Getting to the
point of what can you afford, gasoline or bullets.

Having fired 500 rds of the Widener's Wolf 'magnum' small rifle primers in 5.56, I'm happy with the fit of the primer in the primer pocket in a wide variety of commercial and GI brass, the reliability of the primers, and the accuracy of the assembled ammo (<4MOA). 
Not be match grade, but they work, and resultant ammo is accurate enough.  I recommend the Wolf product & would buy more. 
 

[wcmartin1]

...   Windners had
5000 Wolf brand at 84 to 89 bucks.   Heard a few bad, but mostly OK to
good about them.   Their ammo all goes  bang with mostly good reports.

They recommend if using the small rifle primers for semi auto, to be their
Mag primers.   They are not hotter, but they are harder.   Getting to the
point of what can you afford, gasoline or bullets.

Having fired 500 rds of the Widener's Wolf 'magnum' small rifle primers in 5.56, I'm happy with the fit of the primer in the primer pocket in a wide variety of commercial and GI brass, the reliability of the primers, and the accuracy of the assembled ammo (<4MOA). 
Not be match grade, but they work, and resultant ammo is accurate enough.  I recommend the Wolf product & would buy more. 
 

Thanks for the review.  I previously acquired some of these, but have yet to use them.

[Old Dog]

How about a handy dandy AR upper (S&W) in 5.45X39?  Just picked up two cases (2,160 rnds.) of surplus for $269 shipping and all.  Can't beat that even reloading.  Don't have to worry about picking up the cases either, just gotta clean it good after shooting 'cause it's supposed to be corrosive.

Shot about 1000 rnds. of corrosive .308 through my M1A at the Feb. 2007 RBC with zero issues due to a good cleaning every evening when the day was done so I'm not scared of corrosive ammo as long as I can take care of the rifle afterwards.

Seems like there was something else I needed to do....Oh yeah, order 2 more cases of that steel cased, berdan primed stuff.  This way I shot the AR and save the .223 ammo for some time when I can't clean it after shooting.

[biathlon]

Midway has everything you'll need. CCI#34s, #41s, powder, their customer service is superb.
      Hoarding? You betcha!!

[half_bubble]

Local pawn shop had a Steyr M95 in 6.5x53R. Bore looked brand new. Fit like a glove. As someone
who has never reloaded I let it pass. Might still be there. The reload process was something like: get some .303 brass, size it with a .308 Win. die, then neck it with a 6.5 Swede die.

[SamD]

get some .303 brass, size it with a .308 Win. die, then neck it with a 6.5 Swede die.

Or you could call RCBS and order a set of 6.5x53R Dies and do it on one pass

[half_bubble]

Does the RCBS 6.5x53R die work with a Lee Loader?

[Buckshot]

I agree with Francis.  You're not going to be able to construct ammunition for a .303 any cheaper than you can buy pull down components or create your own pull down from other compatible diameter bullets; then you've got the value of your time to pull-down and recreate the surplus ammunition.  And the spooky factor of not knowing what powder was used, and how that volume of powder relates to the expected powder level for a .303 cartridge.

I say, keep a few hundred rounds on hand and keep familiar with your rifle, but make heavy use of your LTR or other .22 trainer.  I would suggest a 1:5 ratio of rounds fired on the centerfire rifle versus that of the .22.

Who has pull down .303 Brit or even good surplus any more?  I don't mind the Paki (POF) if it is NOT hangfire ammo but I truly don't like that stuff that hangfires.

Have not seen any quantities of good Mk VII or Mk VIIz in some time.  Matter of fact, the last good stuff out there that I remember was the HXP from a few years ago.

Buckshot

[Buckshot]

Anyone have any hands-on experience with the K31 Schmidt Rubin and its 7.5x55 round? Not that I need to add another caliber to the "feed me" inventory, but the rifle intrigues me....

K31 is a modern, strong, front-locking, well made rifle.  The big plus here is that this European 30 cal is identical to US 30 cal; you can use 0.308 slugs!  
I'm happy with my $99, matching serial #, mint bore, accurate K31.  
These weapons saw garrison and training duty, and their condition testifies to this.  K31's are also the rifle cast-offs of... a nation of riflemen.  They're as nice as Swedish Mausers as far as condition, have been cared for by serious shooters, have good triggers, and are accurate.
Brass is available from Norma and a few others now, just shop around online or in SGN.  Ball is expensive, yes, but get reloadable brass instead.  
Schmidt Rubins are good rifles for people who are willing to reload, or else are so wealthy that they can shoot ball with no worries.
7.5 ball never is cheap, probably never will be.
Select for a rifle with matching serial # bolt & receiver (easy to do, they're usually that way anyhow) - headspace is likely to be good then, and the mechanism will have been fit together, as intended, by the original craftsmen and will be slick, not clunky.
Unlike two M1889 Schmidt Rubins in the family which, for some reason, had their bolts swapped, and then the eventual misfortune of having one rifle stolen.  Before the bolt swap, the action was described as working 'smooth as glass.'
Only K31 downside, in my opinion, is the lack of an aperture sight.    

Francis Marion,

The K31s are good accurate rifles (though the Swiss considered them carbines) but they are rough and crude compared to the previous generation, which consisted of the M1896/11, M1911 (both rifles) and the K-11 (carbine version of the M1911 rifle).  The actions on these three are even longer but just as strong and much smoother and in the case of the M1896/11 and M-1911 those 39" barrels just "reach out and touch someone" before the bullet even leaves the bore.

This generation also had the barrel floated in an aluminum collar clamped to the stock at the muzzle that the barrel freely moved through as it heated and expanded in both length and diameter.

Again, nothing wrong with the K-31s but you might equate the M-1896/11, M-1911 and K-11 to a double heat treated US Springfield and the K-31 to an M1903A3.  Both work and both from the same family but the feel is gone with the newest one in each case.

Buckshot

[wcmartin1]

Does the RCBS 6.5x53R die work with a Lee Loader?

No, Sir.

Lee Loaders are hand tools that remove the primer, neck size the case, seat the new primer, and measure the powder using the supplied tools in the kit and a plastic hammer.

RCBS dies will have to be used with a press - Single-stage, turret, or progressive.

However, the RCBS dies will work with a Lee Hand Press which is a single-stage press that you don't have to mount and can use at the kitchen table.

[Buckshot]

Anyone else out there with a M1895 Dutch Mannlicher in 6.5 Dutch?

I understand that .303 Brit cases can be used to make up ammo to feed this little carbine.  Action is smooth as glass.

I have been ordering some ammo from AIM.  Was pleased with the customer service. 


Max

You can make them from .303 British, you may need to turn the rim to .526".

You can buy Bertram Brass from Graf's (or other sources, like Midway), but it isn't cheap. One of the few available items that is worth making versus buying already made.

If you're doing a LOT of odd stuff, like my father and I, invest in a copy of "The Handloader's Manual of Cartridge Conversions", by Donnelly. Amazon has it available.

Nickle,

Have you ever got hold of a cartridge conversion manual from George C. Nonte?  Not as extensive as Donnelly's but rather interesting.

Buckshot

[Nickle]

Probably got one over at the shop.

I do have a personal copy of Nonte's Reloading Manual (techniques much more than data).

A "must read" for any reloading cast bullets in a military autoloader.

[Buckshot]

Probably got one over at the shop.

I do have a personal copy of Nonte's Reloading Manual (techniques much more than data).

A "must read" for any reloading cast bullets in a military autoloader.

Nickle,

Now you've gone and done it, something else I am going to have to look for and invest in.

I have his cartridge conversion manual and his book "Pistolsmithing" but did not know that he had had a reloading manual out.



Buckshot

[Nickle]

Probably got one over at the shop.

I do have a personal copy of Nonte's Reloading Manual (techniques much more than data).

A "must read" for any reloading cast bullets in a military autoloader.

Nickle,

Now you've gone and done it, something else I am going to have to look for and invest in.

I have his cartridge conversion manual and his book "Pistolsmithing" but did not know that he had had a reloading manual out.



Buckshot

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN=0876910460/ From $1.94 and up, most of the mfor $3.99 shipping. DIRT CHEAP, and an asset for just the chapter on reloading for military semi-sutos alone.

[biathlon]

    I own 3 rifles chambered for Winchester 22 mag and absolutely Love the Hornady V-max ammo. All my 22 mag rifles really like the stuff and make nice ragged little holes with it. I'm real glad I bought the Ruger when I did 'cause they don't make it anymore. I've been getting bulk from Cabellas for about $10 per 50 rounds and get the dry storage box with it. Anyone else shoot 22 mag?

[scopeboy001]

    I own 3 rifles chambered for Winchester 22 mag and absolutely Love the Hornady V-max ammo. All my 22 mag rifles really like the stuff and make nice ragged little holes with it. I'm real glad I bought the Ruger when I did 'cause they don't make it anymore. I've been getting bulk from Cabellas for about $10 per 50 rounds and get the dry storage box with it. Anyone else shoot 22 mag?

i do, i own one 22mag rifle and right now it is my go-to gun for varmit controll under 200yrds.

and just like urs, mine loves the V-max ammo, @ 100yrds, all my holes just about touch.

[Oohrah]

Had one in Mossberg Chuckster, but traded it off before the Vmax came out.
However, a Ruger 77/22 Hornet using the 35 grain Vmax is twice as accurate
and really cheap to reload using Lil Gun powder.   It has very low chamber
pressures at somewhere over 3000 fps with 13 grains of this powder.   Very
quiet and accurate at very little cost In fact les than the 22 WRM.