I will preface by saying I am a new AR owner. I have a Ruger MPR in 5.56 with 18" barrel. I installed Magpul MBUS Pro sights on it, the rear sight includes the adjustable dial from 2-6; the front sight has a "standard" width and "target" width. As I understand it, when zeroing the rifle at 25m, I should set the rear dial to 3 (assuming this corresponds to 300m) and adjust the front post to set elevation.
First group POI was around 25 MOA high (using the Appleseed squares target) and 6 MOA left. Manual says elevation is 1 click per MOA, so I do 10 clicks to confirm. Sure enough, next group is right at 15 MOA high. So I click some more... and see the front sight rotate, which it is not supposed to do without using the actual tool. I click once more and it's back on the target width. I give it a little wiggle and it seems to still be in there solid... but it is far outside the base, with the top of the post near the top of the "ears".
My next group is around 5-6 MOA high. I decide to adjust my rear dial to 2, and my elevation is dead on. I adjust windage, which is apparently 0.5 MOA per click, and put all 5 in the black. Now the rear sight is adjusted pretty far to the right, but there is still room for a few more clicks - but it seems to be zeroed...
I say "seems to be" because it bothers me that I had to move the front post that far up AND adjust the rear dial to 2. I am wondering if I should just leave be and verify my zero at actual distance and make notes... or look in to a taller post? Different sights altogether?
it sounds as though you have the MBUS Pro LR the magpul web site indicates their intention for the sight is to be 200-600 meter with 50 meter increments and may not fit exactly with our 25 meter zero.
https://www.magpul.com/products/mbus-pro-lr-adjustable-sight-rear?ProductColor=VO343
because it doesn't follow a 25/300 meter zero
is it fully bottomed out when at 2 or could it go lower ?
I would set all the way down I expect that should be 2 on the rear sight which appears to be the lowest and zero at 50 meters by turning only the front sight so that if your sighting on a square at 50 meters your cutting holes right where the top edge of the sight is if you use a 6oclock hold that would be the bottom edge of the square.
I found on the MBUS plastic sights it wasn't that unusual to have them adjusted to the side a ways and not centered
with xm193 this should have you zero at 50m and 200m
1.5" high at 100 yards
3/4" high at 200 yards
then I would figure out how many clicks on the rear sight to be on at 25 meters and write that down or make a mark on that spot with a silver sharpie
confirm 200 yards or meters if your range has it , is where it should be and adjust as needed to be on at 200 with the front sight post it should only take a bit hopefully
then confirm at 300 and 400 the mark on the sight may or may not actually match the load from your gun Magpul secifies it is a hybred adjustment wheel intended to be withina 7 1/2 inch range
So I would be prepared to make a mark on the actual point
assuming your shooting the KD AQT and 25m AQT
2 should have you for 100 and 200 yards
your next mark up is likely to be 300 yards
the next mark up 25meters
and your final mark 400 yards
different colors for different distances silver and gold sharpies , pint markers of your prefered color or nail polish whatever works for you
although with your 25 meter mark you could shoot the KD aqt bottom edge hold for 100,200, 300 and hold on the 5 not that you will see it with irons but figure it is about 2/3 of the way up for the 400 yard target
you could also set the 400 yard mark so that you keep using the bottom edge hold it is easier to set the target on top of the sight than decide where the middle is for many of us
the reality of ARs is that with most 55gr ammo a 25meter near zero your far zero is about 360-367 yards because of the height of the sight above the center of the barrel
then when your not shooting Appleseed you can turn to 2 and be set encase you need to shoot a coyote or wood chuck or some other target at a more common hunting distance.
I know I do and some of the other instructors who use our rifles for dual duty have our HSZ hunting sight zero and our BSZ battle sight zero and have it written down , on my scopes my turrets zero so HSZ is zero and Appleseed BSZ is a number above that I have written down in my note book.
the reality is they are making a sight to sell to people who probably really only need a 50-200 meter zero but are selling it as an elevation adjustable 200-600 meter sight and our AQT targets don't exactly line up with that.
I've been tinkering with the Magpul Pro LR sights as well. I intend to have the 200 yard zero impact approx 6" high of POA, in order to use a 6 O'clock hold on stage 2. My rough near-zero is about 30 yards. I intend to verify 6" high at 200, then spin the wheel and see where I hit at each corresponding distance. This is with 62g ammo. Should get to test it pretty soon here in TX.
Also, I replaced the stock front sight post with one from KNS Precision. They offer a variety of designs and widths. I'm starting with one that has a V notch cut out of the tip. That way, I should be able to see through that V and tell whether my 6 O'clock hold is right at the bottom of the target. Should be a fun experiment.
I got the Magpul Pro LR BUIS rear sight for my son's rifle.
Here's what it looks like just to make sure it's the same one Misawa has.
(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/S/aplus-media/vc/a2d06112-a2da-4fc7-8643-b8118eb2cd67.__CR0,13,491,491_PT0_SX220_V1___.png)
His carbine is set up as a Dissipator with the actual gas block under the handguard and an ARMS folding front sight way out on the barrel right behind the flash hider.
Here's what the front sight looks like. I am not sure if it's an "F" style front sight base height.
(https://media.mwstatic.com/product-images/src/Primary/908/908119.jpg?imwidth=2200)
We set the rear sight at 2 (200) and zeroed at 50 yards. Just in case there was a problem I brought a few front sight posts of different heights so we wouldn't run into Misawa's problem of the front sight post being unscrewed out of the base.
As it turned out the factory front sight post was fine. I did not measure it so don't know what the height is.
With it properly zeroed at 50/200 yards/meters (your choice) it should be pretty close to dead on at 25 if you rotate the rear sight wheel to 3 or 3.5 or 4.
If a person wanted to prioritize a 25 meter zero I'd suggest establishing a proper 200 or 300 meter zero first (the further the better for total distance accuracy on the wheel settings) then determine the best setting for 25 yards and whether a click or two of the front sight post is worth it as a temporary or permanent fine tune at the expense of the previously established long range zero.
On my A2 rifle with a 50/200 RIBZ I adjust the drum to a click somewhere after the 3 on my elevation drum (can't remember which as it's been a while since I shot it at 25 meters and I think it varies based on if I'm using a .22 conversion kit or centerfire) and it's dead on for AQT's. Same concept for any elevation adjustable rear.
A 50/200 zero has will have you approximately 1" low at 25 meters. As we all know that's 4 MOA so dialing the rear that 4 MOA onto the 300, 350 or whatever setting works out just right so that all your elevation markings are accurate.
Revised Improved Battlesight Zero
https://www.everydaymarksman.co/equipment/ribz-sight-setting/ (https://www.everydaymarksman.co/equipment/ribz-sight-setting/)
Thank you all for your time in replying. You have given me a great deal to consider and put in to practice next time I go out.
Quote from: Lomshek on January 06, 2020, 09:22:02 PM
I got the Magpul Pro LR BUIS rear sight for my son's rifle.
Here's what it looks like just to make sure it's the same one Misawa has.
(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/S/aplus-media/vc/a2d06112-a2da-4fc7-8643-b8118eb2cd67.__CR0,13,491,491_PT0_SX220_V1___.png)
That is exactly what I have. For reference, here is my front sight:
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61IbH6cLMWL._AC_SY355_.jpg)
It took this photo and Trapper Pete's comments to have me finally realize it's a
2 to 6 dial, not a
zero to 6 dial. :slap:
On my next range excursion, I plan to zero at 50 yds (everything at my range is already in yards, so it's just easier for now) and verify/document/mark where the dial needs to be for 25 (I suspect it will be 3 as Lomshek suggests).