In other words, would my scores at 25 yards be a reflection of what score I would shoot at say 100/200/300/400 or 500/600 even 1000 yards?
A short simple answer to that would be a Yes. Yes, your scores at 25 M should represent what your scores at distance would be.
BUT....
Often times it is not....why?
Why would 4 MOA shooting at 25 meters not be 4 MOA shooting at 1000 yards?
Wind for one....let's accept that as a given. Wind will absolutely skew scores between 25 meters and 1000 yards. But wind is NOT a measure of a rifleman's execution of the FUNDAMENTALS of Marksmanship. Wind reading is a skill, like the fundamentals of marksmanship that must also be developed.
Let's forget about wind. Lets assume there is ZERO wind out to 1000 yards. Would 4 MOA shooting at 25 meters equal 4 MOA shooting at 1000 yards without any wind effect? Likely NOT.....but why?
Variation that is the reason why. MOA is just that, an angle....and the angle grows with distance as does the variation.
Especially considering a small bore rifle like the .22. It is absolutely possible to score an Appleseed Rifleman score on a 25 meter AQT with some serious fundamental position flaws. You can absolutely "muscle" your way into a Rifleman score with a rimfire at 25M. I have seen it done over and over again. I've even done it recently without the use of the sling! I have also seen those same shooters absolutely come off a Known Distance (KD) event baffled as to why they were not able to qualify.
It is because they have some fundamental flaw in their position, or in their version of the 6 steps of firing the shot.
So....I highly encourage anyone that has not done so, to try and attend an Appleseed KD event, or in the absence of that a CMP or NRA High Power Rifle match. It is at distance you will learn about some potential flaws in your position.
This is by no means meant to be negative, it is meant to be encouraging. Shooting at distance reinforces those fundamental things done correctly, and brings to light those fundamental flaws.
Improvement at distance will conversely and ABSOLUTELY manifest itself in improved scores at 25 meters.
I am a prime example of that. I squeezed in my Rifleman score at 25 meters with a 220ish score. I then shot KD and NRA events and really did not do that well. I improved my position and started shooting well at distance. I occasionally shoot a 25M Appleseed event and routinely place 247 or better. Still after that "ALL V RING" perfect 250 and it will come, I just need to shoot more 25 M Appleseed events.
So, in closing, it is my experience that a 25 meter performance will not necessarily and not likely reflect a similar score at distance. But.....a distance event score will absolutely reflect the same or better on a 25M AQT, and it is absolutely NOT because of wind! LOL...well....not until you can hold 2 MOA or better.
Regarding wind....I have data at distance (600 yards) and in 95% of the matches I have shot the past 5 years at 600 yards, rarely did I have more than 2MOA on for windage, most times it was significantly less. And, there have been those days where I have had 5MOA or more on for wind, but that is a very rare exception.
For 300 yards, I have never ever had more than 1.5 MOA on for wind.
The above wind data is from NRA targets, circle targets where the 10 ring is 2MOA. Most days the wind will not blow one out of the 10 ring.
When one adds windage, oftentimes it is a novice move to compensate for a poorly executed shot. Speaking for myself here....that is what I have found to be the case, and I have proven it over and over to myself on my electronic training system, a poor follow thru on a shot that was executed in the X or V ring, can absolutely throw the impact wide into the 7 ring!
An example of outstanding fundamental marksmanship and no windage applied (when there is wind), will result in a group that is no larger vertically than 2 MOA, and as wide as the target. That is PERFECT fundamentals! And that is only the wind doing what it does.
Shots that fly high and right/left, or low left/right are a huge indicator of a flaw in the position.
Shoot some distance matches, AS KD or HP. You will learn alot, and then....after improving at distance, come back and shoot a 25M AQT, I bet your scores significantly rise!
R/
Chris
Tryouts for the USA Rifle team for Palma (Fullbore) are pretty cool I hear.
The team is looking for a waterline group. They do not care much about windage, and I'm told, often times they ask the shooter to forget about the wind.
What they want to see is if that competitor can HOLD! That the competitor has the fundamentals!
This is Palma shooting, iron sights, prone with a sling, out to 1000 yards. Palma rifles are all chambered in .308 and they are limited to a particular bullet as well, 155 grain bullets! *You can shoot .223 Palma as well, but why?**
My daughter as an example, I will post a pic of a group she shot at 600 yards at Reade Range in PA. Reade is known for wind! I have not taught her a thing about wind reading yet. Nothing!
I want her to hold a waterline group, and focus on holding elevation. She is there! Now we will start talking about the wind. She has scored at times in the 190's (out of 200) with nothing but a no wind zero on the rifle, or....an initial 1-1.5 MOA wind adjustment before the string of fire. She has also been shooting lighter bullets, 75 grainers. When she learns the wind...starts to learn the wind, we will be giving her the 80 grain bullets with a better BC.
Fundamental marksmanship at distance is all about holding elevation.
In the below pic (attached), shots 7, 10 and 14, are truly her stock placement/fundamental position. The rest of the group was the wind pushing her right and left. That is a very respectable group at 600 yards, when looking at it from a "fundamentals" perspective! She amazed a lot of people that day.
A great wind reading resource would be MSgt(ret) Jim Owen's (google him) approach/advice to wind calling.
His data books, and his method is to cut whatever the wind call is in Half!
If it is 3MOA put 1.5 on the gun.
Why is that? Variation is why, the wind never is exactly the same, and a far left 10 is just as good as a center punched X, or far right 10.
Thank you for sharing your experiences.