Stopped in Dunhams today to pick up some sling swivels. Noticed a Rem 597 in the rack with a 16" heavy bbl and full sized scope. Looked and handled nice, has a grey/green stock. Price was $250. When I got home I noticed that it is on sale tomorrow and Monday w/scope for $200.
Doh! And I'm out of state until Tuesday night!
I'll toss this up for brainstorming. Of late I've been jonesing to accomplish the twin objectives of 1) beginning to acquire some loaners, and 2) gaining experience with other common .22s in the hope it will help me be a better instructor.
The 795 and the 597 seem like the most obvious candidates to begin with (with respects to Savage and Mossberg). I have a personal fondness for Marlin (possibly genetically inherited from my dad) and I like that the small size seems well suited to youth. Off reviews, I'd thought the 795 would be the way to go...but I noted I couldn't find extra mags anywhere (I wanted a mag to see if it would work in a Marlin 989), and a rifle with 1 mag is no good as a loaner, so I took that as a sign that there is not a need to be in a hurry, I can bide my time a little and maybe something would go on sale.
Heading to the store, I did like the handy feel of the 795...but the 597 felt REALLY good, almost Garand like (if such a thing can be true of a .22). Not a lightweight for youth, but...wow, it feels solid. And now it's on sale (and I'm in the wrong state!)
I know some of you personally prefer the 597 or the 795. Any thoughts on any experience you've had with them as loaners?
I have a lot of .22s, a lot as in dozens of various kinds except for 597. While I prefer 10/22s I did buy a couple 795s last year or the year before when they were cheap with a rebate. My go to 795 has tech sights and is accurate as heck. I loaned it last month and the guy was shooting 1/2" groups with it from standing. I have the stock filled with survival stuff and it is my grab and go, all purpose truck gun.
On the other hand, the 597s is Caliper's rifle and loaner of choice. The nice thing about them is that feel like a full size rifle. The one on sale has a short heavy barrel and feels very well balanced. For $200 for the rifle and scope, plus rings, studs and a sling you can easily have a LTR for under $250. That cheaper than you can do a 10/22 but more expensive than a 795 comparably equipped.
Here is a link to a review of the model that is on sale. I'm awful tempted to pick one up.
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2013/04/daniel-zimmerman/gun-review-remington-597-heavy-barrel/
Gander mountain has 795s for 150 after the rebate.
I think the 597 is a real winner in the look and feel department, but I have one that shoots great groups except for the occasional 8 MOA zero shift, and the inability to feed from the magazine when time counts. Considering my problems are in the minority, I might still buy another and prove it was just a fluke with the first one.
Quote from: Grindstone on July 15, 2013, 12:22:22 AM
Gander mountain has 795s for 150 after the rebate.
I think the 597 is a real winner in the look and feel department, but I have one that shoots great groups except for the occasional 8 MOA zero shift, and the inability to feed from the magazine when time counts. Considering my problems are in the minority, I might still buy another and prove it was just a fluke with the first one.
Dumhams has 795 most of the time for $139 on their weekend sales. I bought my two for $100 after the rebate. Haven't heard of a new rebate.
Heaven (and my wife) knows I don't need any more rifles and have no more room in my gun safes for anymore. I will likely sell off one of my many Nylon 66s to make room for a 597.
If anyone is interested in a good deal (compared to what they are running these days) on a very good condition iconic, classic Nylon 66 let me know.
Quote from: Oz on July 14, 2013, 12:16:45 AM
I know some of you personally prefer the 597 or the 795. Any thoughts on any experience you've had with them as loaners?
Fair warning, I may be the 597 fan of the Mi cadre...
I've had good experiences with my 597's as loaners. Drop free mags are nice, plus easier to prep than a 10/22. The bolt rides solely on two steel guide rails so the rifle does not seem to mind powder residue buildup in the receiver. The bolt tends to keep the rails scraped clean and there is enough clearance between the bolt and the receiver that I've never had problems with grime buildup inside the receiver causing any problems. I run the rifle with just a small drop of oil on each of the bolt guide rails.
The stocks are easily free-floated and can be chopped down for youth with a bit of creativity in fitting the buttplate back at the shortened length. I have seen feed issues with some Winchester ammo that has a very angular nose profile. Otherwise, I have never had a problem cycling any ammo that is expected to cycle (CB's and low noise rounds usually won't do it, but subsonic and match ammo are no problem)
Tech sights give a great big sight radius with that 20" barrel and the stock gives a great cheek weld for the tech sights. Be aware however that Remington seems to have a problem getting the screw hole for the front sight perfectly vertical. Each rifle I have bolted my tech sights to has needed the rear sight moved noticeably over to the left.
For scope mounting, I reccomend the Extreme Gun Works (EGW) rail from Midway. It sticks out forward of the receiver and lets you mount the scope where it should be. Not the cheapest rail, but worth it! (They make one for 10/22's as well.) I haven't found an aftermarket stock yet that gives a solid cheekweld with a scope. Working on a solution for that besides pipe insulation...
I personally do not find an issue dry firing the newer 597's. By newer, I mean ones with a round-tipped firing pin design from the past three+ years. I have always dry-dired mine and have three loaners that have been dry fired at several Appleseeds without a problem. No broken pins, no signs of the pin hitting the breechface. I do have one older one (came with the original style plastic mag) that has a firing pin with a tip like a chisel. This particular rifle does have an indent from the firing pin hitting the breech face and did when I bought it used. The indent had raised a small burr in the chamber that would sometimes cause a feed issue. I removed the burr and the rifle has been an active loaner since.
The only big problem I've had with mine as loaners is the spring that pulls the last shot hold open lever back down when the shooter racks the bolt after inserting a fresh mag. I think the issue is with having people manually push this lever up to make the rifle safe (it is inside the magwell, no external controls for the LSHO) and the spring on two of mine has gotten bent so it does not have enough tension to pull the lever back down. This leaves the bolt stuck in the locked back position. The lever is easy enough to remove on the firing line as a field solution, but I think I will be advising students to just rest the bolt on the chamber flag if they did not empty their mag during a string of fire in the future.
Where was I ... Oh, yeah, the 16" HB model... I absolutely love the 597 with a short barrel. The carbine size is great. For a youth rifle however, I would reccomend a standard 597 and take your barrel to Wizard to shorten it. Reason is weight: the stock profile barrel will save weight over the HB. For me to play with, I was asking gunshops about the 16" HB shortly after Remington announced it, but the price was more than I wanted at the time. May have to visit Dunhams on the way home now...
Well I bit the bullet so to speak and dropped 2 Cs on 16'" HB today. I really wanted a 597 to play with and learn about since I see them on the line (particularly when Caliber is around). Probably won't be loaner for kids though, it is way too tacti-cool looking for children ;).
I have to admit though that when I stripped it down I LOL'd at the trigger group. 10/22 snobs complain about the plastic trigger group on the newer 10/22. The 597 is like a plastic box with some parts scattered around inside it.
Scope that came with it is a cheap generic 3-9x32 variable. Rings are way too high for it. Biggest problem I see is the scope mounting low enough and far enough forward. Thanks for the scope rail tip Derek. Wizard informs me that the HB model is an ideal candidate for a low mounted scout scope so I may end up going that route with it.
I did mount a scope and a sling and will likely run up to my hunting property to sight it in along with a couple other rifles.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v489/mac66/IMG_0398_zps1eaed593.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/mac66/media/IMG_0398_zps1eaed593.jpg.html)
BTW, Dunhams in Sterling Hts had valuepack center fire pistol ammo in stock today. No .22lr though.
Mac, I think you may have just cost me $200... ;D
Too bad they don't come with that sling. and a second mag...
Quote from: Caliper on July 15, 2013, 06:00:01 PM
Mac, I think you may have just cost me $200... ;D
Too bad they don't come with that sling. and a second mag...
Sorry man. ^-^
These were good rifles last year with the other barrell and were only $120, but they were hard to find and the mags have to be ordered.
I sighted it in. Pretty decent shooter, made me look good. 1/4"" 5 shot group, prone with a loop sling at a measured 25 meters and bulk pack Blazer ammo. That's despite the too high, too far back, crappy, cheap scope that I couldn't even see the holes in the paper through. Not even going to mention my standing group. It was the best standing 10 shot group I ever shot. So yeah, it's a keeper.
Very happy with my 2 Remington 597's, one standard and one HB. They shoot great with the right ammo (anything CCI seems to work well). Even the cheapo Rem. golden bullets shoot accurately (but with too many duds). Both hate Fed Automatch and Amer. Eagle though. Both will cycle sub-sonic just fine but not "low power." I knew nothing about firearms when I went into Dunham's about 18 months ago to buy my first one. Figured I'd start with a .22lr. Was going to go for the Savage 64 that was on sale but it felt like a kids toy in my hands compared to the Remington.
There are a couple of aftermarket stock options out there that look to have the higher comb and more suitable for scoped applications, here are the two that I found:
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/188303/boyds-tacticool-rifle-stock-remington-597-unfinished-laminate
http://www.usariflestocks.com/Remington-597-Stock-Tundra.html
Both need additional stock inserts sold by "Stockys"
With the heavy 3-12x40 Leapers scope I mounted on the HB model, its comes in at a shade over 7 lbs. so has more the look and feel of a full sized high power rifle. The extra weight helps to stabilize the muzzle better as well. Came with a 3.2 lb. trigger right out of the box. Seems that the HB models come with a nickel plated/teflon coated hammer and perhaps a little more favorable hammer notch like the VQ hammer. The mag feeding issues that are common are quite easy to fix (usually a little filing of the casting flash on the parting line inside the mag). Would definitely like to push the scope another 1" forward though.
The Dicks and Walmart versions of the HB have a different barrel, at 20" with traditional 6 land/groove rifling instead of the 5R of the 16"
Now a 10/22 build is gnawing at the back of my brain. I think I have the "bug." lol
For anyone who missed the first sale (like me, D'oh!) Dunhams will have these rifles on sale again for $200 Friday and Saturday. ^:)^
Areg: Unfortunately, the Tacticool stock does not have a higher comb than the factory one. :'( Mine looks great finished in boiled linseed oil, but is better suited to iron sights than a scope
You might take a look at the Boyds Evolution though. I handled 'burbs 10/22 with that stock and it was very nice.
For a scope mount, check out the Extreme Gun Works part that Midway sells. http://www.midwayusa.com/find?userSearchQuery=egw+597 It's pricey, but worth it. The rail extends forward of the receiver and lets me position the scope correctly even with my long neck. They even make a 20moa inclined version. :---
Don't forget you can build the 597 as well! A Jard trigger, Jarvis barrel and Boyds stock should be quite the shooter!
Same deal this week--$199.99 ends today. Sending from the counter.
Quote from: Oz on August 19, 2013, 01:59:10 PM
Same deal this week--$199.99 ends today. Sending from the counter.
And there you go... ;D
If anyone runs across a reasonable source for extra 597 mags, I am interested.
Quote from: mac66 on August 19, 2013, 03:31:04 PM
Quote from: Oz on August 19, 2013, 01:59:10 PM
Same deal this week--$199.99 ends today. Sending from the counter.
And there you go... ;D
If anyone runs across a reasonable source for extra 597 mags, I am interested.
Hi Mac,
Found this source online (can't vouch for them though). Price is right.
http://www.lg-outdoors.com/products.asp?cat=12095
I used to see these mags carried at both Dunham's and Walmart but it's been a while
Quote from: Areg on August 20, 2013, 01:11:26 AM
Quote from: mac66 on August 19, 2013, 03:31:04 PM
Quote from: Oz on August 19, 2013, 01:59:10 PM
Same deal this week--$199.99 ends today. Sending from the counter.
And there you go... ;D
If anyone runs across a reasonable source for extra 597 mags, I am interested.
Hi Mac,
Found this source online (can't vouch for them though). Price is right.
http://www.lg-outdoors.com/products.asp?cat=12095
I used to see these mags carried at both Dunham's and Walmart but it's been a while
Thanks,
BTW, are we going to see you in Fenton? Got something colorful with your name on it.
Quote from: mac66 on August 19, 2013, 03:31:04 PM
If anyone runs across a reasonable source for extra 597 mags, I am interested.
Three weeks ago they were in stock at the Gander Mountain in Saginaw--I don't recall the price as I didn't need any at the moment. :wb: (Once upon a time, I used to pick up mags and ammo for firearms I did not yet own...just in case. And someday, as I'm fleeing zombie hordes, I will come across a MP44 in the street...and I'll remember
exactly where in my basement I left that 7.92 short ammo.) :'(
But while we're on the subject and now that I also need 597 mags...do any of our 597 connoisseurs/aficionados have advice on the mags? I've seen a couple comments that there are aftermarket mags available (keepshooting.com) that may be better than the Remington 3rd generation. Thoughts? Opinions? Unfounded speculation? All welcome and most appreciated! :)
Quote from: Oz on August 20, 2013, 12:47:50 PM
Quote from: mac66 on August 19, 2013, 03:31:04 PM
If anyone runs across a reasonable source for extra 597 mags, I am interested.
Three weeks ago they were in stock at the Gander Mountain in Saginaw--I don't recall the price as I didn't need any at the moment. :wb: (Once upon a time, I used to pick up mags and ammo for firearms I did not yet own...just in case. And someday, as I'm fleeing zombie hordes, I will come across a MP44 in the street...and I'll remember exactly where in my basement I left that 7.92 short ammo.) :'(
But while we're on the subject and now that I also need 597 mags...do any of our 597 connoisseurs/aficionados have advice on the mags? I've seen a couple comments that there are aftermarket mags available (keepshooting.com) that may be better than the Remington 3rd generation. Thoughts? Opinions? Unfounded speculation? All welcome and most appreciated! :)
I hear ya, I have some sten and CETME mags I don't have guns for anymore as well as Beretta 92/Taurus 99 mags, S&W Mod 59 series mags for guns I've never owned. I even have a 71 round drum mag for a Suomi. ??? which I never got around to buying or building.
I may have a CETME, and something that is compatible with the 59 series mags. If you don't need them.
I only have one oddball. XD mag for .357 sig, and no it won't work for .40...
number6
Quote from: number6 on August 20, 2013, 05:55:11 PM
I may have a CETME, and something that is compatible with the 59 series mags. If you don't need them.
I only have one oddball. XD mag for .357 sig, and no it won't work for .40...
number6
Let's talk
Quote from: mac66 on August 20, 2013, 10:40:10 AM
Quote from: Areg on August 20, 2013, 01:11:26 AM
Quote from: mac66 on August 19, 2013, 03:31:04 PM
Quote from: Oz on August 19, 2013, 01:59:10 PM
Same deal this week--$199.99 ends today. Sending from the counter.
And there you go... ;D
If anyone runs across a reasonable source for extra 597 mags, I am interested.
Hi Mac,
Found this source online (can't vouch for them though). Price is right.
http://www.lg-outdoors.com/products.asp?cat=12095
I used to see these mags carried at both Dunham's and Walmart but it's been a while
Thanks,
BTW, are we going to see you in Fenton? Got something colorful with your name on it.
Still thinking hard about it Mac and I may show up on 9/21-22. Would really like to discuss things with you, and/or Caliper and 'Burb's. A little at a loss as to where I take things from here. Really enjoy the shooting and would like to get more trigger time and possibly like to try some competitive shooting (maybe CMP rimfire sporter) in the near future but since I don't belong to a club, opportunities seem limited. I can't even shoot seated at the local range due to how their benches are set up. I did find a match coming up in late Sept. that's a possibility. Would also like to go to an RBC at some point but I don't yet have an accurate high power rifle (my best Mosin looks to be at best about 3MOA off a bench). I do enjoy teaching very much but feel so inexperienced with shooting being a relative beginner. Bought "Position Rifle Shooting" and am studying up to make up for my lack of experience.
BTW, the "keepshooting.com" 597 mags have received really good reviews but they haven't had them in stock for a long time. The price at LG outdoors is really good.
Quote from: Areg on August 21, 2013, 10:14:48 PM
Quote from: mac66 on August 20, 2013, 10:40:10 AM
Quote from: Areg on August 20, 2013, 01:11:26 AM
Quote from: mac66 on August 19, 2013, 03:31:04 PM
Quote from: Oz on August 19, 2013, 01:59:10 PM
Same deal this week--$199.99 ends today. Sending from the counter.
And there you go... ;D
If anyone runs across a reasonable source for extra 597 mags, I am interested.
Hi Mac,
Found this source online (can't vouch for them though). Price is right.
http://www.lg-outdoors.com/products.asp?cat=12095
I used to see these mags carried at both Dunham's and Walmart but it's been a while
Thanks,
BTW, are we going to see you in Fenton? Got something colorful with your name on it.
Still thinking hard about it Mac and I may show up on 9/21-22. Would really like to discuss things with you, and/or Caliper and 'Burb's. A little at a loss as to where I take things from here. Really enjoy the shooting and would like to get more trigger time and possibly like to try some competitive shooting (maybe CMP rimfire sporter) in the near future but since I don't belong to a club, opportunities seem limited. I can't even shoot seated at the local range due to how their benches are set up. I did find a match coming up in late Sept. that's a possibility. Would also like to go to an RBC at some point but I don't yet have an accurate high power rifle (my best Mosin looks to be at best about 3MOA off a bench). I do enjoy teaching very much but feel so inexperienced with shooting being a relative beginner. Bought "Position Rifle Shooting" and am studying up to make up for my lack of experience.
BTW, the "keepshooting.com" 597 mags have received really good reviews but they haven't had them in stock for a long time. The price at LG outdoors is really good.
Come by Fenton, both me and Burbs will be there.
And BTW for others, The 597 HB is on sale again this weekend.
Found 597 mags online at Walmart in stock and $12/ea.
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Remington-Model-597-22LR-10-Shot-Clip/17654658
Quote from: mac66 on August 27, 2013, 03:04:13 PM
Found 597 mags online at Walmart in stock and $12/ea.
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Remington-Model-597-22LR-10-Shot-Clip/17654658
Looks good so far...I have an e-mail saying my "pick up at store" order has been shipped.
Quote from: Oz on August 27, 2013, 03:34:54 PM
Quote from: mac66 on August 27, 2013, 03:04:13 PM
Found 597 mags online at Walmart in stock and $12/ea.
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Remington-Model-597-22LR-10-Shot-Clip/17654658
Looks good so far...I have an e-mail saying my "pick up at store" order has been shipped.
Thanks to you for the heads up. I got a notice that mine have shipped as well.