Does anyone have experience with this rifle...Seems like it would be great for Appleseed event...Thanks...
Steve in Kansas
Here is our experience with the Colt's we have. Would not cycle reliably. Looked on Colt's website, tried their suggested adjustments. Got onto you tube and got some information about adjusting the bolt spring. Thought that would work. Didn't. Tried different ammo. Once we tried CCI Mini Mag's, viola. They worked. They don't like sand. Found that out at an Appleseed where one daughter was shooting that the range was mostly sand and steady winds was blowing sand around. Sights OK and 4MOA groups, no problem. 10 round mags available. Hard to get good cheek weld on the adjustable stock. Standard stocked version with 20" barrel is better if you are going to use open sights.
Also have experience with S&W MP-22. Reliable. Eats all ammo. Can drop in national match trigger if you so desire. 10 round mags now available. Nothing to call on these in our experience.
Have also seen Mossberg and Ruger tactical style .22 on the line. No persnal experience though.
Good luck in your search.
LTC,
I looked at these extensively a week or so ago: general impressions seem to be fairly poor. It has limited compatibility with centerfire AR-15 parts, and the battery of arms isn't quite the same. Additionally, they're fairy expensive and seem to have reliability issues throughout the line. That led me to look elsewhere for my Liberty Training Rifle (LTR) needs.
I will second the recommendation for the S&W M&P 15-22: I've seen one in action at an Appleseed, and it was brilliant! They mimic the AR-15's battery of arms completely, take standard AR-15 trigger groups, and short 10 round magazines are available. If I was to outfit one for an Appleseed, I would make sure to pick up at least two 10rd magazines, a rail mounted sling swivel that fits a 1 1/4" wide sling, and of course, a GI Sling, either cotton or nylon (Can be purchased from the RWVA store, and others).
No matter what you choose, remember that Appleseed is very much "Run what you brung", and will be happy to see you no matter what you bring!
IIT Lars has one here in Indiana. The issues mentioned here are what we found too: reliability, odd functions, and the mags did not want to drop free.
My 15-22 is completely the opposite. Love it! Makes a great rifle for kids due to length and weight. It is accurate and functions reliably enough. I have the threaded model which made it a good suppressor host:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8AsKPQ6Mk1c
In any event, I will say this: a 10/22 would do anything these rifles would for less $ and be more reliable than either. If, however, you want a good duplicate of an AR for practice, the 15-22 is great.
But, in the end, it is not the rifle that matters, it is the shooter's skills, knowledge, and determination that makes a Rifleman. Come, shoot, have a ball.
Thanks for the great info...I think I will dampen down my enthusiasm for a while! I will be attending my first Appleseed event 8-9 October with my trusty Ruger 10/22...It has been in the closet for, oh, about 14 years...Got it out last week and cleaned and lubed it...Going to take it out today and see what happens....I agree that the shooter makes the difference...Why spend $500 to do something my 14 year old, $130 rifle will do just as well?...I guess 24 years in the Army and shooting the M-16 sort of made me think about the M4 style...I may add the Tech 200 peep sight to the 10/22...Also considering a Marlin 795 for my grandson... Any thoughts on that rifle?
I am a bit confused about shooting at the event...I notice that some people use scopes and some don't...Is there a preference, and can you shoot for the Rifleman Patch using a scope? My eyes aren't what they used to be, but scopes vs open sights in the same category seems odd...Really looking forward to getting into the group and progressing...Hope I didn't ask too many questions! Thanks again,
Steve
The opinions you are going to get on scopes is varied. If you have old eyes, most instructors won't have a problem with it. The other thought on scopes is that they are a crutch, and you should learn to "Drive a stick" (use opens) before you use a scope. I say do whatever works for you, but if you think you can use irons, do so. HOWEVER: Whatever you do, don't use the factory 10/22 sights. They are the worst thing ever invented, and a bane at Appleseed. The adjustment for them basically consists of hitting them with a hammer. My personal experience has been with a scope, that's what I shot on when I first started shooting. Now I'm learning open sights again. It sucks. Tech Sites are great though. Easy to adjust, and easier to see then the Ruger factories.
Hope this helps, please don't hesitate to ask any other questions.
Saw someone recommend the SR-22 from Ruger, and have to respectfully disagree. We had one at a recent shoot. The scope rail is too high, the cheek weld ends up being a chin weld, if at all. Plus, for a tactical trainer, or just to save ammo money, the controls are way different then an AR anyway.
+1 on the S&W M&P 15, works great, and the trigger isn't even to terrible.
Roland
LT,
For older eyes a scope is fine your scores count the same. I suggest a low power scope. There are a number of very reliable and economical scopes available. My personal favorite is the Nikon 2-7 shotgun scope. I keep it on 2X. For my first Appleseed I found one of the "full size" walnut stocked Ruger 10-22s, even though I already owned two 10-22s. Put Tech Sights on it and a G.I. loop sling and went off to practice. With my eyes I could not use the open sights effectively (I've had ocular lens replacement in both eyes). When looking through the rear aperture the front post gets a distinct bend. I ended up with a Marlin 795 with the Nikon 2-7. I completely fell in love with that combo. I've since set up a 795 for my gradson and another for my brother. They are cheap, reliable and wickedly accurate.
Best of luck on whatever you decide on.
csw
The Marlin 795 is a great choice. Add tech sights or a scope. Stock sights on most .22LR leave much to be desired. It is light and accurate. I lost mine to my daughter once she shot it. :slap: I am thinking of getting another.
Getting back on the topic of the Colt Umarex carbine, I bought one when they first came out, and it has been nothing but trouble. Very unreliable. Replaced it with a Smith & Wesson 15/22 - that's the ticket. Love it!
I'll chime in on the Colt M4-22 (got one when they first came out, too). If you really want one, go ahead--I did. It was a "jammomatic" until I adjusted the bolt per manufacturer, and yes, Mini-Mags are best, but it now feeds all of my other stuff, except Remington Bulk. Do I regret it? Sometimes..... Would get the S&W if I had it to do over, but I'll keep it and play with it since it will probably be difficult to sell it. If I did, would prob have to take a huge loss.