Hey, I'm not trying to be the lone ranger here, I just have some time on my hands. Feel free to jump in to correct something you see wrong or to add info you feel needs to be covered.
Just doesn't "copy" over from microsoft word and line up right. What a mess. Back to pdf's.
Looks good to me.
ETA --- looks lile we're using these threads as a storehouse of Fun Facts To Know & Tell About Various Rifles, so here's some Garand-input:
1) If you load the en-bloc clips so that the top round is on the right & the bottom round is on the left, you'll get more reliable feeding (on some but not all rifles).
2) If the rounds are not seated all the way back against the rear wall of the clip, DO NOT press the bullet tips against something solid in order to push them backwards.
3) 'Garand-thumb' occurs when the bolt is suddenly released and the thumb is in the way. This is usually the result of the bolt not being fully locked rearward, and instead is 'propped' against the follower; when the follower gets depresessed, "BOO-YAH!", the bolt smacks forward, inflicting a mighty crush to the thumb.
So make sure the bolt is locked fully back.
GR, your post reminded me that if the rounds are loaded in the clip the way you suggest it's also easier on your thumb (if you're right handed) to push the clip down into the rifle.
Going along with your third point is a description/demonstration of the proper way to position and hold your right hand while inserting a clip.
PS. I've watched our left handed buddy crashkid2k load his M1 and it just scares the thumbnails right off me. ooooooooohh!!! than would have to hurt if that bolt ever jumps forward when he's pushing a clip in with his left thumb!!!
thanks for the additions
It would be wise to add that some M1's don't automatically release the bolt when an en-bloc is inserted. I own one of those, and at first I thought something was wrong with it. No problem, though, it's fine, and the easiest M1 you'll find, thumb wise.
It's nice to be able to insert the enbloc, then release the bolt.
I will agree that it looks scary when a prone lefty loads an M1, but think about the mechanics.
The left hand is over the rifle, and the left thumb pushes the en-bloc into the rifle. The remainder of the left hand is on the right side of the rifle, preventing the op rod from moving forward.
I'll see if I can get a picture of it in the next few days.
It all seems natural to me, but I've been left-handed for quite some time now :).
This is straight out of FM 23-5. However, I'm not really comfortable with it - reasons in red text.
Loading the Rifle
(a.) Single round. To load a single round, pull the operating rod all the way to the rear. (yes, if it's all the way to the rear it should lock but I feel better telling newbies to insure it's locked to the rear with the safety on.) While holding the muzzle below the horizontal, place a round in the chamber and seat it with the thumb. With a knife edge of the right hand against the operating rod handle, force the operating rod slightly to the rear. Push down on the follower assembly with the right thumb and allow the bolt to ride forward. Remove the thumb from the follower assembly and release the operating rod handle, allowing the operating rod to go all the way forward. (What's this!?!?!? Folks on this forum constantly talk about the dangers of a slam fire and here's the US Army manual telling you to do exactly what everyone says you shouldn't do - let the bolt slam forward on an already chambered round.)
(b.) Full clip. To load a full clip, hold the rifle at the balance with the left hand and pull the operating rod handle all the way to the rear. Place the butt of the rifle against the thigh or on the ground. (I don't load my M1 with the rifle positioned as described and don't figure we want people doing this at Appleseeds either.) With the right hand, place a full clip on top of the follower assembly. Place the thumb on the center of the top round in the clip and press the clip straight down into the receiver until it catches. (no instruction here to keep the fingers extended down by the receiver to stop the op rod from coming forward while your thumb is in front of the bolt. This is telling someone how to get Garand Thumb.) Swing the right hand up and to the right to clear the bolt in its forward movement. Note that the operating rod is not held to the rear during loading since there is no danger of it going forward as long as pressure is maintained on the top round in the clip. It may be necessary to strike forward on the operating rod handle with the heel of the right hand to fully close and lock the bolt.
(c.) Partially filled clip. To load a partially filled clip, hold the rifle in the same manner prescribed for a full clip. With the operating rod all the way to the rear, place an empty clip into the receiver. (Need to remind folks the empty clip will not fully insert or lock in at this point) Place the first round into the clip and on the follower, to the left of the follower slide. Press the second round into the clip, exerting a downward, turning motion until the round snaps into place. Load the remaining rounds in the same manner. With the knife edge of the the right hand against the operating rod handle force the operating rod slightly to the rear. Push down on the top round with the right thumb (make sure the clip locks in place -my experience is this can be a little tricky till you get the hang of it - I bought 2 and 5 round clips and wasted my money as they don't work like an 8 round as the clip does not lock into place as with an 8 round clip. You still have to push down on the clip/rounds while manipulating the op rod to get the clip to lock in), allowing the bolt to start the top round forward. Remove the right hand and allow the operating rod to go forward. (need to add that it may be necessary to bump the op rod forward to get it to strip the top round and chamber it.)
Any ideas about revising the FM 23-5 instructions to make a (newby) workable set of loading instructions?
Thanks.
A little help in putting new rounds back into the empty clips (also from FM 23-5). This looks fine to me (as if the US Army cares what I like but remember this is to help the new M1 shooters coming into the RWVA).
Loading Rounds into a Clip
(a.) Insert eight rounds into the clip, holding the clip, open end upward, and the rounds in palm of your left hand. Start placing the rounds in from the lower left of the clip and make sure that each round is against the rear wall so that the inner rib of the clip engages the extracting groove of each round. The top round will then be on the right, making the clip easier for a right handed firer to load in the rifle. For the same reason, clips are loaded this way at arsenals.
(b.) Each time rounds are loaded into a clip, the clip should be checked for long rounds. If one rounds extends beyond the others, it will be hard to load the clip into the rifle. The long round should be seated by removing the top round, pushing the long round into place and then replacing the top round. Tapping the bullet against a solid surface to seat the long round may result in the bullet being pushed back into its cartridge case. This may damage the bullet or break the bullet seal which could result in changes in the ballistic performance of the round.
Not sure this one will come through. Shows grease application points for the M1. If it doesn't I'll have to figure out another way to do it.
Quote from: M1A4ME on December 15, 2007, 08:58:19 PM
....... With the right hand, place a full clip on top of the follower assembly. Place the thumb on the center of the top round in the clip and press the clip straight down into the receiver until it catches. (no instruction here to keep the fingers extended down by the receiver to stop the op rod from coming forward while your thumb is in front of the bolt. This is telling someone how to get Garand Thumb.)
Nope, you can't get Garand thumb by loading a full clip. Try it. You get Garand thumb by messing around with your digits inside the magazine when the gun is unloaded.
The op rod can't go forward until you release the pressure on the clip - that's the way Garand designed it. A worn bullet guide can mess up the timing of this, but not enough to get you Garand thumb.
I read a thread on the CMP forum a few days ago that really took me by surprise.
This guy had feed issues and had tried EVERYTHING. He was a pretty sharp guy, and was at his wit's end before he even posted about his problem. Lots of other really sharp people posted their input, and his rifle still didn't work.
As it turns out, Gus (of Gus's Garands fame) suggested that it might be "tolerance stacking". That's a situation where each individual part is barely in spec, and this results in an entire group of parts being (as a whole) out of spec.
Gus was right; that particular group of parts would never work together.
I wouldn't have believed it. If the part mikes to spec, then it's good as far as I'm concerned.
Yet another opportunity to learn...
crashkid2k,
Yep tolerance stacking is real. ask any machinist. It can ruin your whole day when running a lathe and trying to turn high tolerence parts close to specs that must operate with other high tolerence parts made by someone else and assembled by yet another.
The solution is always to "return to zero" with new internal parts for the rifle. Fortunately parts for the "guts" of a Garand are still fairly easy for find andf affordable. This is why having spare parts is so important. Shoot, get a few extra whole M1's from CMP and then you have your own inhose supply as a rady gun until and unless you need the parts for your primary.
Had a similar exerience with an AR this last weekend with an lower parts kit that just wasn't getting it. Switched out the hammer and voila, tried the orriginal hammer with another trigger and voila. So nether was the problem by itself, but together they were a no go.
Quote from: Talon on March 16, 2008, 04:08:42 PM
It happened today, using Greek ball. It turned out to be a good thing....
My M1 has always been elusive. I've diagnosed and replaced parts; crowned the muzzle; knurled the barrel. I changed the stock. Little by little, the rifle got closer, but was never "right on". I would seemingly have to warm up, or settle in, before I could turn out really good groups.
Today was no exception. I fired a crazy group on a cold barrel, and as the rifle heated up, things tightened. Par for the course, until on my third round of my third enbloc, something broke, and I had for a brief period a bolt gun. No cycling at all. Junior Birdman was there, so we pulled it off the line and took a look.
The gas plug contents were gone! The plug was there, it was just completely stripped of a spring and metal at the bottom of the lock. Now, when I bought it back in November, JB commented the valve was sort of loose but I never changed it.
We put in the lock nut from JB's garand; I fired a group, and viola! A three minute group. I fired another: Same thing!
To this, I say, "duh". I should have remembered the loose valve, and changed it long ago. Now my rifle is "on".
I posted this as a possible solution if a reader is chasing a loose rifle. I never even thought the loose valve lock contents would have mattered. The swap of parts totally brought my M1 together.
The gas plug on most USGI Garands has a one way spring and plunger assembly that allows the use of rifle grenades. This not a needed feature and can sometimes fail.
It should be replaced by a solid plug, they are cheap and remove a potential liablity.
M1 Garand rear sight disassembly .pdf from Surplusrifle.com attached.