Invite NYT Reporter?

[VietVet]

Since Calverton, LI is the closest DAR to NYC I'd like to invite the writer of the NYT Article to join us at the Shoot in September.
Let him see what really happens at an AS Shoot.
I'll even pay for his ticket!

Thoughts?

[George63]

He knows what happens at an appleseed, he did a full RBC, shot the score and was at Winterset IA with the video guy for the full weekend, even did some shooting there

[VietVet]

He knows what happens at an appleseed, he did a full RBC, shot the score and was at Winterset IA with the video guy for the full weekend, even did some shooting there

And he still comes off like that. Amazing!

[Son of Martha]

He knows what WE believe about Appleseed, doesn't mean that he buys into it.  Also consider that the editor has a lot to do with how an article comes across and we don't know how much is writer and how much is editor.

In any case, we have had folks show up and NOT agree with us-- or agree and then do nothing to help.  What seems so obvious to us might be completely non-intuitive or even incomprehensible to someone from a different background.  This one just happened to be able to get an article printed about his thoughts.  Actually given his background and the social pressures/expectations likely in the social circles he is in or wants to be in, this article is better than it could have been.  Expecting a rah-rah pro-Appleseed story was not reasonable.  I did hope for a little more in-depth explanation of our motivation, and proper context.  Oh well.

And so ya'll know, he IS on this forum.  I dunno if he has the interest or time to respond to a barrage of PM, though...

SoM

[Chainsaw]

...and Manheim, PA, last fall.

He knows what happens at an appleseed, he did a full RBC, shot the score and was at Winterset IA with the video guy for the full weekend, even did some shooting there

And he still comes off like that. Amazing!

[slim]

You should still invite him though!

Even though the article came out like it did, it's possible he can understand the mission and spread the 'seed. Perhapst it wasn't his call how the article turned out. Or, maybe it was. - Gotta work on him a little more!

[eaglescouter]

He also attended the California state wide instructors meeting last summer along with Fred and Funfaler...

[kDan]

I posted a general Calverton invite to New Yorkers in the comments section of the article, but for some reason, the thing hasn't updated since last night.  I couldn't resist 7th stepping the ny times.

If this guy comes to Calverton, he's comp'ed, but I bet his interest in Appleseed has closed like a chapter.  Personally, I didn't think the article was all that bad, but I do think the editors ran with it a little bit.  I've read some of this guys other stuff and he tends to side with the under-dog and the misfit, which in this case, would be us.  Like SoM says, it could have been a lot worse.  I suspect the video is more in keeping with the authors perception of Appleseed.  The video was pretty good, even though it does have some shooter standing there voicing his own personal opinions that have nothing to do with the program.  

I think it would be nice to get the facts out there that Appleseed takes folks who may have more dangerous or isolated ideas, and brings them into a community of calm, thoughtful people which can help turn them into productive and inquisitive mentors rather than self-destructive loaners.

Either way, the article is irrelevant.  

[Xeyed]

With all the time spent with the program, I'm not sure what benefit a shoot invite would bring.

The author has already been to an RBC and spent time with the national team.

Several cliches are bouncing around my head in response to this question.

The first, You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make  him drink.

Hopefully the time spent with Appleseeder's and the message will become more meaningful with the passage of time.

The next is that when the student is ready, the teacher will appear.

Some day the author may circle back to Appleseed, and we will find a spot on the line or a Hat.

On the other hand it might be "It's like MTV, Some folks just don't get it"

[VietVet]

With all the time spent with the program, I'm not sure what benefit a shoot invite would bring.

The author has already been to an RBC and spent time with the national team.

Several cliches are bouncing around my head in response to this question.

The first, You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make  him drink.

Hopefully the time spent with Appleseeder's and the message will become more meaningful with the passage of time.

The next is that when the student is ready, the teacher will appear.

Some day the author may circle back to Appleseed, and we will find a spot on the line or a Hat.

On the other hand it might be "It's like MTV, Some folks just don't get it"

You make several very good points.

Most likely he'd never accept the invite anyway.

I'd like to add this however, I'm willing to bet he's never had a taste of the water that's served at a Shoot at Calverton! 

[techres]

So.... How are you New Yorkers using this brief moment to your promotional benefit?

This is only gonna be and open door/issue for another 72 hours.  How you spending that time?

Techres

[VietVet]

So.... How are you New Yorkers using this brief moment to your promotional benefit?

This is only gonna be and open door/issue for another 72 hours.  How you spending that time?

Techres

Didn't realize this was just a NY issue.

The NYT is read not only in NY, but pretty much world wide.


The door is opened for ALL involved in the Appleseed Program.
Not sure how it will end but BEFORE the door is closed shouldn't we all use this time to our advantage?  

[techres]

VietVet, I think you misread me.

I am cramming in Indiana to get word out to everyone I can think of and saying, "Appleseed made the NYT!"   

I was wondering how you guys were maximizing this since you are literally in the breach.

That's what I was trying to ask and obviously fumbled with.

Techres

[AFTERMATH]

Hey New York;

As I perused the comments there WERE a few people from New York that did appear to sound interested.
Why don't you post the invite on the commentary?

[George63]

from what the writer said -the video guy was independent and had more control of his own content

[VietVet]

Hey New York;

As I perused the comments there WERE a few people from New York that did appear to sound interested.
Why don't you post the invite on the commentary?

This has just been done. Also with parts of the letter from the  National Branch. Now lets see if the NYT will post it.

[VietVet]

Hey New York;

As I perused the comments there WERE a few people from New York that did appear to sound interested.
Why don't you post the invite on the commentary?

This has just been done. Also with parts of the letter from the  National Branch. Now lets see if the NYT will post it.

FYI...shortly after submitting the above mentioned post I was waiting to see if the NYT would post it.

While on the NYT site my computer was HIT HARD by VIRUSES!

Now I have no idea if there is a connection but I've never had this happen before. Hopefully I did manage to "Restore" my computer to a prior time and all seems to be OK as of now,

BEWARE!!!

[Josey Wales]

..OK here we go again, do I tell everybody in gods creation about the NY Times article ?.. no I do not.. Why, cause to me it is not the representation I desire. I do not want to start a conversation on the defense, I would rather give someone a Josey Wales tri fold conversation starter flyer and start off on the right foot, we do not need the NY Times so please stop with this thinking that we finally broke through, it pains my heart to see Appleseed Instructors gloating at the thought that The NY Times let us into there world. We do not need them at all, and that is how I see it.. I am not limiting our potential or limiting where or who to 7th step, so please do not miss read my idea, I am simply saying that NY State is doing very good just go look at our flow chart and see the new ranges and attendance numbers, we are doing well, I have 5 new ranges I am working on right now, will all of them accept, maybe not but a few will.. I look at our NY Instructors and see many dedicated faces, we all have met and worked together and respect each others abilities..So to base what NY is doing in a challenge to 72 hours and the NY Times, I just do not buy it.. First of all, NY State had nothing to do with the article and or the writer, we were not a part of the article(accept on a National level of course).. The NY Times has offices all over America, and I can say with almost certainty that If I had been there I would of, well let us just say that I would of kept a short leash on that reporter so his mind would not stray into outer space like it did.. Now I am sure some may think of me as harsh or defiant, but please remember I am from this town called NY and 4th generation at that and If I was asked prior to the article my opinion, I would of suggested something a bit different..I will not go into detail but I would of had some input to share..
..As for the any exposure is good exposure I disagree,...
..If I have to hold someones hand to type in Appleseed Project in a Google widow so they can take a look, forget it...
..They know how to use computers very well just look at all the comments they managed to sling at us....
........The ship is sinking and thats America, We, all the Instructors choose to take up buckets and bail water to stay a float, OK I am still on track right, now The New York Times is or are the sharks in the water waiting for each or all of us to fall over board to make minced meat of us and the article is the chum you put into the water to call as many sharks over as possible........LOL..........................
............................................................I hope I offended someone!!!WAKE UP they are not our friends.......... and If I need to explain to one person on this forum what I mean, I will demand you come to NY City and I will personally take you to Manhattan and we will talk to people at randome about what we are about and watch there reactions....or should I just ask you to go read the comments under the NY Times article..
...JW.......................................................

[VietVet]

Hey New York;

As I perused the comments there WERE a few people from New York that did appear to sound interested.
Why don't you post the invite on the commentary?

This has just been done. Also with parts of the letter from the  National Branch. Now lets see if the NYT will post it.

They posted it. See comment # 165. I had to register under the name WarVet as VietVet was taken.
Hopefully it will help. We'll see.

[kDan]

I posted an invite as well on saturday night, but it's only what I would have done anywhere I seen AS mentioned.  Like I said above, this article is irrelevant.  If I'm glad for any reason that it happened, it's that we can show that even with a brief (hopefully) spotlight on us, we can move on.  We don't need to hide and OUR message is consistent whatever tag line is placed in large font.

To be honest, the prospect of a bunch of people showing up at one of our shoots because they read the NY times doesn't particularly excite me.  Don't get me wrong, it's fine and they're welcome and encouraged to come; it's just that up to this point, folks that show up at Appleseed show up because they needed to find us, not for the novelty or to twitter about it to their golf buddies.  That said, I'm sure it'll bring in some good people who just had no idea what to do. 

After all, is there any reason why someone should not know how to operate a rifle?  And the history belongs to all of us. 

[DesertDog]

..OK here we go again, do I tell everybody in gods creation about the NY Times article ?.. no I do not.. Why, cause to me it is not the representation I desire. I do not want to start a conversation on the defense, I would rather give someone a Josey Wales tri fold conversation starter flyer and start off on the right foot, we do not need the NY Times so please stop with this thinking that we finally broke through, it pains my heart to see Appleseed Instructors gloating at the thought that The NY Times let us into there world. We do not need them at all, and that is how I see it.. I am not limiting our potential or limiting where or who to 7th step, so please do not miss read my idea, I am simply saying that NY State is doing very good just go look at our flow chart and see the new ranges and attendance numbers, we are doing well, I have 5 new ranges I am working on right now, will all of them accept, maybe not but a few will.. I look at our NY Instructors and see many dedicated faces, we all have met and worked together and respect each others abilities..So to base what NY is doing in a challenge to 72 hours and the NY Times, I just do not buy it.. First of all, NY State had nothing to do with the article and or the writer, we were not a part of the article(accept on a National level of course).. The NY Times has offices all over America, and I can say with almost certainty that If I had been there I would of, well let us just say that I would of kept a short leash on that reporter so his mind would not stray into outer space like it did.. Now I am sure some may think of me as harsh or defiant, but please remember I am from this town called NY and 4th generation at that and If I was asked prior to the article my opinion, I would of suggested something a bit different..I will not go into detail but I would of had some input to share..
..As for the any exposure is good exposure I disagree,...
..If I have to hold someones hand to type in Appleseed Project in a Google widow so they can take a look, forget it...
..They know how to use computers very well just look at all the comments they managed to sling at us....
........The ship is sinking and thats America, We, all the Instructors choose to take up buckets and bail water to stay a float, OK I am still on track right, now The New York Times is or are the sharks in the water waiting for each or all of us to fall over board to make minced meat of us and the article is the chum you put into the water to call as many sharks over as possible........LOL..........................
............................................................I hope I offended someone!!!WAKE UP they are not our friends.......... and If I need to explain to one person on this forum what I mean, I will demand you come to NY City and I will personally take you to Manhattan and we will talk to people at randome about what we are about and watch there reactions....or should I just ask you to go read the comments under the NY Times article..
...JW.......................................................

[gunville]

Invite someone from something people actually read,like the drudge report...

I doubt we could ever get Glenn Beck, but how about one of his cohorts?

[Me]

Maybe someone less polarizing then Glen would be better.
I don't agree with him but went to an Appleseed.
If Glen was pitching it I probably wouldn't go for fear of not fitting in.

[kDan]

Hey Me, come back to another AS.  


E-mail me at rwva.nyc@gmail.com

[B9]

Maybe someone less polarizing then Glen would be better.
I don't agree with him but went to an Appleseed.
If Glen was pitching it I probably wouldn't go for fear of not fitting in.

Me,
You sound like me. 
We keep things as non political as possible at Appleseed and if GB was going to one I would go, but maybe not for why you may first think.
Appleseed and it's message is for all Americans not just one side or the other. Some/most of the media seems bent on trying to push people to one side or the other. 

[gunville]

Beck reaches millions of listeners each day, which would fill every shoot.

I would prefer that to someone "less polarizing" any day.

Beck is an ardent supporter of the 2nd Amendment, and studying and returning to our nations heritage and the direction of the founders. He advocates peaceful means of changing our country and avoiding violence. He see's our country as a force for good. He believe we need to be waking our neighbors.

If that's not what Appleseed is about, then maybe I've misunderstood and don't belong.

I don't think we'd get the hack job from Beck that we got from "The Gray Senile Lady".  It's clear the author fit everything to fit his preconceived notions, and poo-poo's the key messages. His underhanded comments like "all white", and getting the view from the most extreme folks he could find show that right away. 

WE ALL KNOW THIS IS'NT APPLESEED.  He should interview some kid and ask him what he learned that weekend.

My parrot will be using the NYT article for what it's best for.

I could see Beck grasping the fire-extinguisher metaphor instead of accusing us of training snipers and being responsible if someone does something. Do you hold a Driver's Ed teacher responsible if one of his/her students ends up DWI and killing someone?

B9: I'm convinced there are many Americans that just don't want to hear the Appleseed message. These include many at the NYT, and our lovely national elite.  But these are a minority. Unfortunately, they have sway over many of the sheeple that have not yet awoken.

[Me]

Maybe someone less polarizing then Glen would be better.
I don't agree with him but went to an Appleseed.
If Glen was pitching it I probably wouldn't go for fear of not fitting in.

Me,
You sound like me. 
We keep things as non political as possible at Appleseed and if GB was going to one I would go, but maybe not for why you may first think.
Appleseed and it's message is for all Americans not just one side or the other. Some/most of the media seems bent on trying to push people to one side or the other. 

I agree, and having Glenn Beck promoting Appleseed wouldn't make it better with the media, that's all.
Like you guys said at my AS, grassroots and not top down like the Redcoats (using Glenn would be top down) 

I had a great time at my AS, zero politics, improved my skills a lot just in time for the next hunting season, and learned some detailed history. I was glad there were a few families with their kids.

Thanks guys for keeping it going.

[Vergeltung]

Josey Wales, for the win. 

[ChevalierdeJohnstone]

As this is my...2nd? 3rd? comment on the forum I hesitate to blaze away with both pistols like Josey Wales.  Also I don't know how to fire a pistol, but I'm pretty sure blazing away with both hands is not proper marksmanship.*  But...yeah.  Well said.

I have to STRONGLY push back on the prospect of "comping" the author of _any_ news article which mentions Appleseed.  As I understand it, Appleseed shoots are free for "women, youth under 21 years of age, and active military".  There would appear to be clear policy reasons (which I support) for offering free training to these groups.

What exactly is special about the New York Times as it relates to Appleseed?  Or any other publication?  If we're going to make Appleseed free for all news reporters, okay.  I think that's a bad idea, but at least it makes sense.  But just one author for the New York Times, simply because he mentioned Appleseed in an article?  I know a few people in the news biz, and there were MANY more people involved in that story than the gentleman whose name appears after the title.  Why aren't they free?  For that matter, what about the hundreds or thousands of bloggers who mention Appleseed?  Are they second-class citizens now?

Let's continue to invite EVERYONE to any Appleseed, but not send special invitations or free tickets to anyone simply because they write an article.  The rifle is an equal opportunity tool, if you can manage to train your pet monkey to pull the trigger for you.  Let's keep Appleseed that way as well.

If a free ticket has already been offered, I would suggest politely following up and saying something to the effect of, "We're sorry, but in the interest of equal opportunity and fairness, our code of values won't allow us to provide special dispensations on ticket prices.  You're more than welcome to attend at cost the same as everyone else, and if you can't afford a ticket we can try to work something out."  I think that's fair - it's not like it's costing him any extra.

* Come to think of it, Clint Eastwood clearly carries two Colt Walker 1847 Revolvers in that movie, so the term "pistol" is not strictly accurate.

[ChevalierdeJohnstone]

On the larger issue, while I don't hold it against Glenn Beck that he clearly read my mind and stole my idea for a primetime TV show, let me suggest that soliciting _any_ media involvement in Appleseed is a bad idea.  As commenter "Me" said, "Grassroots and not top down."

Any media organization, whether for-profit or not, is going to have their own objectives in any coverage they provide.  Let's focus on learning the History and the principles of Rifle Marksmanship.  Let the free press write whatever they want about it - that's their constitutionally-protected right.  But I don't see anything in the Appleseed Mission Statement about "shaping the media dialogue" - and I like it that way.

By all means send your favorite double-chinned TV personality fan mail and invite them to come to a shoot as a private citizen.  (I did.  Twice.)  But let's keep Appleseed by and for private citizens, not major multimedia conglomerates.