Author Topic: So; the Hard Question?  (Read 860 times)

Offline PaxxAZ

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So; the Hard Question?
« on: December 08, 2011, 01:42:03 AM »
What is 2012 looking like?

I know it seems like a small issue, and has been addressed to some degree, time is ticking away and someone needs to step up.
While I acknowledge there is probably space I have not looked into in this Forum, or another area I do not know about…there are no AS’s after this current Month. Does this not Alarm anyone?

Just a thought
PaxxAZ – AKA Pablo
There are many things talked about that make the people of the US
different; being riflemen is one, asking why is another, as is getting
what needs doing done.

-Me 2011

Offline azmule

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2011, 10:41:32 AM »
The cancellation of the Kingman shoot has left me with some actual free time this weekend (but only if I'm successful at not *telling* anybody that I won't be in Kingman)   ;D  I'm going to put together at least a preliminary 2012 schedule.
Talk is cheap because the supply exceeds the demand.

Do or do not - there is no "try."'  -Yoda

Offline AWDboostADDICT

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2011, 11:00:54 AM »
right now I have 5-6 guys from greater phoenix area interested in going to one of the events!
A few of them would also like to have their son's come out and shoot at it too.
most of them just want a schedule and a good amount of notice so they dont have anything planned.

Offline AZRedhawk44

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #3 on: December 09, 2011, 12:44:21 PM »
I'll find out when the next Rio board meeting is and get a few 'Seeds on their schedule.

ETA:  December 21st.

I'll attend and pitch 4 Appleseeds for next year.  One of which will be April 21/22 weekend for April 19th.

I'll ask for:
Feb 25/26
April 21/22
Oct 6/7
Nov 24/25
« Last Edit: December 09, 2011, 12:52:27 PM by AZRedhawk44 »

Offline AWDboostADDICT

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #4 on: December 09, 2011, 01:50:16 PM »
I think that sounds awesome.

Offline PaxxAZ

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #5 on: December 09, 2011, 05:08:41 PM »
Redhawk:

Let me know if you need another Rio member or two for more of a numbers thing, though I think they will be receptive after last time, some of the ROs where talking about it for a while among themselves when they saw my 10/22. 
There are many things talked about that make the people of the US
different; being riflemen is one, asking why is another, as is getting
what needs doing done.

-Me 2011

Offline PaxxAZ

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #6 on: December 09, 2011, 05:16:38 PM »
Also the Ranges all seem pretty full already  :'(

Black poweder pistol ??? :wb:  :D

But lets see what we can do. if memory serves me the Turnout last year seemed pretty spot on.
There are many things talked about that make the people of the US
different; being riflemen is one, asking why is another, as is getting
what needs doing done.

-Me 2011

Offline azmule

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #7 on: December 11, 2011, 12:04:52 AM »
I've requested from Buckeye:

Feb. 3-4
Apr. 21-22
June 16-17
Sept. 8-9
Nov. 3-4
Dec. 1-2

And from Kingman:

March 24-25
April 21-22
May 26-27
Oct. 6-7  (sent that request off before I saw your Rio dates - I can reschedule if you get that one.)
« Last Edit: December 13, 2011, 07:30:38 PM by azmule »
Talk is cheap because the supply exceeds the demand.

Do or do not - there is no "try."'  -Yoda

Offline AZRedhawk44

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #8 on: December 12, 2011, 11:34:07 AM »
Redhawk:

Let me know if you need another Rio member or two for more of a numbers thing, though I think they will be receptive after last time, some of the ROs where talking about it for a while among themselves when they saw my 10/22.

Yes, certainly.  Very welcome.  Anecdotal testimony and support always helps with something like that.


The one thing I want to get out of the board, though:  It currently costs the actual Appleseed Instructor putting the event together, $100/day to reserve the range.  I'm not terribly eager on that point.  And I don't want to front that for all 4 events for 2012 ($800).  But I don't see any other AZ SB's stepping up to front it either.

Yes, the money is balanced out by charging X dollars per day to the shooters.  But it's a headache.  I'd rather have the range just charge X dollars per day to the shooters.

And that $100 dollars / day?  It only covers the smallbore range.  If we want the HP range on Sunday afternoon, that'll probably cost more.

So some additional voices that understand the economic dynamics of the Appleseed program, versus that of a typical for-profit firearms instruction course, would be very welcome.

Offline PaxxAZ

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #9 on: December 12, 2011, 01:10:44 PM »
Totally in for the 21st, is it $800 all up front? Ouch!!!

On the Non-profit nature of things, I think they would be receptive, but also we are not "the Boy Scouts" "the 4H" and such, we have youths, but it is a harder sell as we are very young as far as these groups go.

What about the Normal monthly events and that  of members and their scheduled events?


Trying to play devils advocate, what are we providing the range? The majority of the Sat/Sun are club events. The Boy Scouts paint the Sign on the hill....

Just not sure that the "for profit" side of things is the reasoning for the $100 a day up front price tag.  I'll ask this weekend to some of the guys who hold weekly events and regularly attend meeting (or have at some point in the past) see what I can find out.

There are many things talked about that make the people of the US
different; being riflemen is one, asking why is another, as is getting
what needs doing done.

-Me 2011

Offline AWDboostADDICT

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2011, 05:29:52 PM »
Wow, That is alot of cash up front.
How was the last Rio Salado turn out?

Offline PaxxAZ

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2011, 05:59:43 PM »
Seemed to be 22 on Sat and 5 on Sunday.

http://appleseedinfo.org/smf/index.php?topic=22510.msg175526#msg175526

This was the first time I saw Appleseed in action, had read and heard some prior, and thought...Ah, they'll be at Rio Salado again soon....

I am now kicking myself for not going that weekend, but at the time I had thought scoping in my rifle was a better use of Saturday Morning. How little I knew then...well I don't know that much more now...man I'm pretty dumb!!! :wall: 

Note:
(the last is a Joke for those who are not sure, or perhaps not depending on you PoV).
There are many things talked about that make the people of the US
different; being riflemen is one, asking why is another, as is getting
what needs doing done.

-Me 2011

Offline AWDboostADDICT

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #12 on: December 13, 2011, 10:27:12 AM »
Wow with 22 people on saturday that could easily make up for the $200.
Rio Salado reservations seem worth it, but the turn out in buckeye might not be worth it.
Any news on the range working with us on that since appleseed in non profit?

Offline PaxxAZ

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #13 on: December 13, 2011, 11:54:00 AM »
We will find out when we go, I will ask some people I shoot Silhouette with on Saturday, as some run other disciplines.
There are many things talked about that make the people of the US
different; being riflemen is one, asking why is another, as is getting
what needs doing done.

-Me 2011

Offline slinged_in

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #14 on: December 16, 2011, 11:58:29 AM »
I share your concerns RedHawk.  Let's email off line and try to come up with a strategy for allowing the AS program to operate AT Rio on a "Pay as you go schedule".  We should definitely work out some sort of a deal with the leadership at Rio....  We should mention Appleseed's 501c3 status... Alot.

What we offer Rio in return....  The Appleseed program is the only program in the country that blends marksmanship skills with building a connection to one's heritage.  Shooting sports in this country are on the decline, while an apathy of our heritage is on the rise.  By reaching out to those who would gladly keep their rifles tucked in the back of a safe, we've built up their base of customers, and done some good for not only the community, but the country.  Since we're bringing new people to the range, they should see the numbers of their customers increase.  How can they go wrong?   :)

slinged_in

Offline PaxxAZ

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #15 on: December 16, 2011, 01:37:10 PM »
  Shooting sports in this country are on the decline, while an apathy of our heritage is on the rise.

I'm all for Propaganda and such, but Shooting Sports on the decline??? Based on what info because everything I am hearing is the opposite.

If you are talking 60s to now, probably, but are we talking % or numbers. are we talking Hunters or range shooters? And if we are talking 90s to now, we are increasing drastically. Black Friday had the biggest number of background check in requests in the history of the program.

Range shooters are probably at near record numbers right now.

Apathy for sure, but are more so now then ever before?


http://nssf.org/Newsroom/releases/show.cfm?PR=041910.cfm&path=2010


http://newsfeed.time.com/2011/12/04/gun-sales-shot-up-on-black-friday/

Also Rio has a different problem, being too full. Or established disciplines not making room for other new groups.

http://riosaladosportsmans.com/calendar/month.php

least number of participants at an event I have witnessed on a weekend was 10, but I am not going around keeping count.

We need to have a message, but we always need to know that our message is factual.

We also need to take into account local trends, I am sure some ranges in the state have lost membership, Rio Salado has almost doubled (or more) in the last 4 years. This is the home range of at least one world class shooter, and I thing a couple of others.

I met a couple who retired to AZ to shoot at that range.

I don't think it is that special, but it is a happening range.
There are many things talked about that make the people of the US
different; being riflemen is one, asking why is another, as is getting
what needs doing done.

-Me 2011

Offline lysander6

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Re: So; the Hard Question?
« Reply #16 on: December 20, 2011, 04:37:49 PM »
Sierra Vista for 2012:

    3-4 MAR        Articles of Confederation Day
    21-22 APR     Revolution Day
    15-16 SEP     Treaty of Paris Day
    15-16 DEC     Boston Tea Party Day

I would like to host a KD (Instructors Only) range (up to 500m) in the 3rd or 4th quarter.

Bill
Gun control is mind control.

" Of every One-Hundred men, Ten shouldn't even be there,
Eighty are nothing but targets,
Nine are real fighters...
We are lucky to have them...They make the battle,
Ah, but the One, One of them is a Warrior...
and He will bring the others back."

- Heraclitus (circa 500 BC)

My Blog:  http://zerogov.com/